Which version of Creation do you claim? No offense intended Brian. I'm serious though. Which version? The Biblical version or the Incan version or the Comanche version or one of the myriad of other possible creation versions? And, if having chosen one of the multitude to be the "true" version (albiet completely void of any empircal evidence other than faith in the source) why that particular one? Scott
----- Original Message ---- From: Brian Riordan <[email protected]> To: Diana Tomchick <[email protected]> Cc: CaveTex <[email protected]> Sent: Wednesday, January 9, 2008 7:19:38 PM Subject: [Texascavers] Re: Way OT Re: [Texascavers] "Science, Evolution and Creationism"--free download from the National Academies Press I'd hoped that my intro " Addressed to the many evolution vs. creationism e-mails i've recieved the last few months:" would have covered that confusion. My response encompasses months of evolution vs. creationism e-mails. I had refrained from responding prior, but felt that the opportunity presented itself today in the e-mail topic and my current mood. I did not intend to sound confrontational or accusing towards any specific e-mail author especially Diana Tomchick. -B On 1/9/08, Diana Tomchick <[email protected]> wrote: I don't know if I totally understand where you're coming from here, but I simply posted some info about a publication that anyone can download for free and read. If you read the publication, you will see that it addresses the fact that many scientists are also religious; the publication does not mock religion and its practitioners, and I did not intend to mock them with my posting, either. I simply intended to encourage people to access the publication, read it and think about it/discuss it with other people. There is even a "Frequently Asked Questions" section of the publication, in case you have unanswered questions about the subject. I felt this was pertinent to this list serve as the topic of biology and evolution (with respect to troglobitic creatures) is a common one in caving. Diana On Jan 9, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Brian Riordan wrote: > Addressed to the many evolution vs. creationism e-mails i've > recieved the last few months: > > What alarms me the most, is not only how often this list serve is > used to debate science, evolution and creationism, but how there > are no questions about creationism, only derogatory comments > towards creationists and the sad, misguided people who can't get > through life without an imaginary friend holding their hand (on a > side note, if you only make criticisms, YOU are the narrow-minded > one, usually a faux paux among such a liberal crowd). If you get > an ego boost by boasting how scientifically superior you are by > mocking Christians in a crowd of people you know are almost sure to > support everything you say on the matter (which is pretty > cowardly) then fine. But this isn't the forum for it (at least I > thought it wasn't). > > If you have QUESTIONS on the matter, state your thoughts/ > arguments/ questions in a non-argumentative way, as if you're truly > hungry for another perspective, and not simply hoping to hear your > sentiments echoed back off a crowd of like-minded people, and I > promise I'd do my best to answer from a different point of view. > Besides, constructive criticism or questioning only encourages > thought- which I welcome. > > I hope this is recieved the way I intended. > > -Brian > > PS. Most Creationists i've talked to don't argue against evolution > as a process in life. It's the evolution as a cause of life that > science and logic breaks down. > > > > On 1/9/08, Diana Tomchick <[email protected]> > wrote: While perusing the latest issue of Nature magazine, I > happened upon > this editorial. You can download the 88-page booklet from the > National Academies Press web site for free (you must register with an > email address and a zip code first). It looks like an interesting > read. > > I reprint the editorial below for your interest: > > Nature volume 451 (10 January 2008) > > "Spread the word: > > Evolution is a scientific fact, and every organization whose research > depends on it should explain why." > > Three cheers for the US National Academy of Sciences for publishing > an updated version of its booklet Science, Evolution, and Creationism > (see http://www.nap.edu/sec). The document succinctly summarizes what > is and isn't science, provides an overview of evidence for evolution > by natural selection, and highlights how, time and again, leading > religious figures have upheld evolution as consistent with their view > of the world. > > For a more specific and also entertaining account of evolutionary > knowledge, see palaeontologist Kevin Padian's evidence given at the > Kitzmiller v. Dover trial (see http://tinyurl.com/2nlgar). Padian > destroys the false assertions by creationists that there are critical > gaps in the fossil record. He illustrates the fossil-rich paths from > fish to land-based tetrapod, from crocodile to dinosaur to feathered > dinosaur to bird, from terrestrial quadruped to the whale, and more > besides. > > Creationism is strong in the United States and, according to the > Parliamentary Assembly of the Council of Europe, worryingly on the > rise in Europe (see http://tinyurl.com/2knrqy ). But die-hard > creationists aren't a sensible target for raising awareness. What > matters are those citizens who aren't sure about evolution — as much > as 55% of the US population according to some surveys. > > As the National Academy of Sciences and Padian have shown, it is > possible to summarize the reasons why evolution is in effect as much > a scientific fact as the existence of atoms or the orbiting of Earth > round the Sun, even though there are plenty of refinements to be > explored. Yet some actual and potential heads of state refuse to > recognize this fact as such. And creationists have a tendency to play > on the uncertainties displayed by some citizens. Evolution is of > profound importance to modern biology and medicine. Accordingly, > anyone who has the ability to explain the evidence behind this fact > to their students, their friends and relatives should be given the > ammunition to do so. Between now and the 200th anniversary of Charles > Darwin's birth on 12 February 2009, every science academy and society > with a stake in the credibility of evolution should summarize > evidence for it on their website and take every opportunity to > promote it. > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > Diana R. Tomchick > Associate Professor > University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center > Department of Biochemistry > 5323 Harry Hines Blvd. > Rm. ND10.214B > Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A. > Email: [email protected] > 214-645-6383 (phone) > 214-645-6353 (fax) > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > Visit our website: http://texascavers.com > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [email protected] > For additional commands, e-mail: [email protected] > > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * Diana R. Tomchick Associate Professor University of Texas Southwestern Medical Center Department of Biochemistry 5323 Harry Hines Blvd. Rm. ND10.214B Dallas, TX 75390-8816, U.S.A. Email: [email protected] 214-645-6383 (phone) 214-645-6353 (fax)
