Pranam
Sri GK became irritated. I do not consider any one who had registered
here brandishing GK useless and what was written by me Mr Mani and others
here are never unparliamentary at all except a dual war against whom this
word GK never used at all which shows that the difference is not studied
well . If Mr GK had seen he is recycling the matter and that too after the
lapse of years the subject recycled had changed the science but never even
rested to check facts. Apart from this he alone writes to many GURUS
asking for the details on many subjects and having recycled all of them,
remains adamant (he says it is not but those who can remember Kasi sradham
and bada khana etc ) in telling that still once done at Kasi all is
finished and no more any srardham need be performed; and when I wrote it is
not on basi he refused to accept; then when I pointed out his own so called
GURU reply to the same answer, he simply brushed aside calling that person
as useless; all are available in your emails. Then he was adding others
already read as his collections and said posting in other groups etc;
because he refused to listen I said better let him not include mine; what
was his 77 yrs answer?; "unless you come and plead that mine shall be
posted I won't do it"; so he is welcome but always I say he shall spend
time in better research and add new things than washing the same cloth
again and again with the staunch reflections. No one shall harp and
every one shall host a knowhow appealing. That is ll. Then his cuttings
will be different and delightful. But writing about srardham since 2011 or
about Kerala Tongue in the halfway like Mala pooh poohs the members who are
also knowledgeable. Mala is mountain if so why malayalam letters?; in how
many languages that word is used if he could see he would have written in
variety; instead in order to do 6 topics a day recycling from old or
resurrecting the custom of one sect where the readers are from many parts
well I will leave it to members. This is what Mr Mani wrote and where is
the unparliamentary text then read DNAs of some one but remained silent?;
Had you read Mr YM and Sridharan or Sekar or Rangarajan one would see the
blossoming fountains organising the garden of knowledge. But at 77 why
mala?. And had you carefully gone thro I would never write independently
like you but heighten what you failed to note down in your scriptures which
you might have done. You have stuff but adamant to only to fill in
competition. Pardon me if I slip K R IRS 17121
On Sun, 17 Jan 2021 at 07:39, 'gopala krishnan' via iyer123 <
[email protected]> wrote:
> Respected friends,
>
> I am made a member in the Kerala iyer google group and Patti thatha
> google group . I joined only iyer 23 google group.
>
> *F**rom the number of responses I receive I find a good percentage of
> members wait for my postings. It is a truth. *
>
> I have observed M.r Rajaram Krishna Moorthy sends at least ten responses
> a day. For him Mr. APS Mani does not set limit. *I do not think it is a
> healthy discussion*. If setting limit is to be done it should be done by
> moderators impartially.
>
> One may read the thread mails earlier for the* RUDE, ROUGH AND
> UNPARLIMENTARY USAGE BY Sri APS Mani. *I am not here to read the abusing
> language of Sri APS Mani and keep quiet.
>
> Recently there was a posting on *Hill (Mala) by me *. In central Kerala
> we call hills as Mala. While a senior member responded Mala means mountain,
> In Malayalam what I have read *for mountain the word is Parvatham. *MR
> APS mailed to me *I am adamant*. What I know I write. Many are there to
> read and appreciate my mails.
>
> I am aged 77 and Know what is adamancy. I can refrain from making any
> posting to the google groups. I need not waste my energy and time for
> getting blamed and ridiculed. The yard stick should be the same to every
> body.
>
> I am marking this mail *with thread *to all the groups. Unless members
> express to conitinue postings, sorry , *no more posting will appear from
> me from now onwards. I* will be a reader and personal responder if I
> desire
>
> Sincerely,
> Gopala Krishnan
>
>
>
>
> On Sunday, 17 January, 2021, 05:37:40 am IST, APS Mani <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
> A handful group of members have decided approx two years ago that Mr
> Gopalakrishnan (GK) limits his postings to three. He sticks to the same
> normally but at times experiments with more than that number. The reason
> for such restrictions is that in the past he used to post a series of
> useless topics in large numbers and there was an exodus of members going
> out of the group. They – quite a few of them who left – appealed for
> restrictions of his postings and thus arrived at the less number, i.e., to
> three. We would have lost at the least more than 50 members before we
> brought out the restrictions. I was asked to be one of the person to
> look after that GK does not exceed the number of postings to not more than
> three. I was volunteering for them. When he exceeds periodically, I
> request him directly to his mail account and not through the Group.
> Yesterday a fourth posting came and I pointed to him to restrict the
> postings to three for future. (the request was made directly to him and
> not through the group mail) I have no idea as to why he did - he
> posted a fifth one and that is the time I wrote the warning on behalf of
> all of whom requested him in the past – to restrict the postings once
> again, that too directly to him. There is no unparliamentarily words used
> except to restrict him to bombard the group with a number of mails as he
> did in the past. This he did in the past irrespective of the feelings of
> many and we do not want him to do it again. Now we have the Google group,
> all the more the discipline has to be maintained. The forum should be
> used by all and not to be dominated by GK alone and that is the
> philosophy. This note is to bring the matter to the attention of all.
> The Forum is going very well and quite a few topics discussed at length by
> learned members which are of utmost value to all. Let that be continued
> and not DOMINATED by GK and that is what the request is. Thanks, best
> wishes and respects to all. Due credit should be given to GK for his
> regular postings and that enables the Group to discuss at length on various
> topics though GK at times act stone headed. That is secondary but we value
> regular postings but the number of postings should be restricted to THREE
> as decided in the past. For the information of all in the group and
> request GK to adhere to the norms.
>
>
>
> Mani
>
>
>
> *From:* gopala krishnan [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* 17 January 2021 04:12
> *To:* APS Mani; Patty Thatha; Iyer; Kerala Iyer
> *Subject:* Re: CULTURAL QA 01-2021-13
>
>
>
> Sir,
>
> You are using unparliamentary words . I am posting this response to groups
> . There is a limit to my tolerance . You have exceeded. You are trying to
> ridicule a member. Your language is threatening.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Gopala Krishnan
>
>
>
> On Saturday, 16 January, 2021, 09:04:12 pm IST, APS Mani <[email protected]>
> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> As if it is a vengeance? You are nowhere near that level, in writing
> style or in the command of knowledge. Your level – I rather restrict my
> words. Stupidly is at its best in your sending this mail beyond your quota
> limit. I will next time onwards put it in the group as suggested by the
> Inner Group.
> Mani
>
>
>
> *From:* 'gopala krishnan' via iyer123 [mailto:[email protected]]
> *Sent:* 16 January 2021 20:49
> *To:* Patty Thatha; Iyer; Kerala Iyer
> *Subject:* [iyer123] CULTURAL QA 01-2021-13
>
>
>
> *CULTURAL QA 01-2021-13*
>
> *Being a compilation there may be errors*
>
> *Q1 What are Indian railways unknown facts?*
>
> A1 *Respected Piyush Goyal Minister of Railways and Commerce* &
> Industry at Government of India October 20-2020
>
> History of Indian Railways is a treasure trove of interesting facts and
> trivia
>
> Many people may not be aware that there is a Railway Station in India
> which falls in two different states
>
> Navapur Railway station, on the Surat - Bhusawal line, is a unique station
> as a part of it is in Gujarat, while the other part is located in
> Maharashtra
>
> Navapur is Taluka Headquarter in the Nandurbar district of Maharashtra
>
> My note- I am happy to add a QA from quora answered by the Minister of
> Railways and commerce.
>
> *Q2 What is the difference between Tamil Nadu and Karnataka?*
>
> A2 Ashank D'souza 16-1-2021· Lives in Bengaluru, Karnataka, India
>
> Economy
>
> Karnataka and Tamil Nadu are two major economies in South India and
> together with Kerala they have higher or equal GDP as 13 other states:The
> blue colored states produce the same GDP as the 13 yellow colored states.
>
> The most striking difference in the two economies is that Karnataka s
> economy which while registering higher growth rates for the past decade
> mostly relies on the service industry and which is of course a low labour
> intensive economy. On the other hand Tamil Nadu relies on manufacturing
> more which is a labour intensive industry. This means that Karnataka will
> inherently have a problem with spreading its prosperity to people outside
> of the elite group getting jobs in the service sector.
>
> Human Development
>
> In the human development category and within that in the sex ratio
> subcategory Karnataka outperforms Tamil Nadu, although both perform well
> compared to the national average:
>
> Politics
>
> In the category of politics there is a stark contrast with Karnataka
> usually voting for two national political parties, one regional in the
> state level while Tamil Nadu usually goes with two regional political
> parties in both levels. In the Lok Sabha elections Tamil Nadu votes for
> Tamil nationalistic parties while Karnataka usually votes for pan India
> nationalistic parties like: Congress/BJP.
>
> Food
>
> Karnataka has Mysore Pak which is popular even outside KA while Tamil Nadu
> has Jaggery Payasam, Coconut Pitha.
>
> *Q3 What happened to Samba after the Kuruksethra War?*
>
> A3 B Dharuni· February 11, 2018Associate Software Engineer at
> Bosch (2018–present)
>
> Samba was the son of Lord Krishna and Jambavati. The events related to
> Samba, the destruction of Yadavas and the demise of Lord Krishna is
> described in “Mausala Parva”[Destruction of Yadavas through a club], 16th
> of 18 books of Mahabharata.After the coronation of Yudhishtira, Krishna
> went back to Dwaraka to rule over the kingdom. Blessed by the presence of
> the Goddess of Wealth (Rukmini), the people enjoyed a luxurious life. Slowly
> the curse of Gandhari about the destruction of Yadavas started taking form.
> The Yadavas were in eternal bliss in Dwaraka. So much bliss, that they
> forgot good conduct, morals and the importance of discipline and humility.
>
> Once great sages like Vishwamitra, Durvasa, Vashista, Narada were on a
> pilgrimage. After visiting various places, they visited Dwaraka to meet
> Lord Krishna and Balarama. The Yadavas, who were once virtuous devotees of
> Krishna, had lost their sense of culture and discipline. A group of Yadava
> boys who saw the great sages decided to play a prank on them in order to
> test their powers. They dressed Samba, the son of Krishna and Jambavati,
> as a woman and tied many robes to his belly so he'd appear as a pregnant
> woman. They approached the sages and asked them to predict whether the
> 'lady' would give birth to a boy or a girl. The Rishis realised the truth
> through their divine vision and were enraged. In anger, the sages cursed
> them saying that the disguised boy will give birth to a bolt of Iron which
> will destroy the entire Yadava race.
>
> The Yadavas, shocked though but were too arrogant to even apologise. They
> left the place, laughing off the curse as the speech of one who had lost
> all his sanity. Things were however very different the next morning.
> Samba developed labour pains and soon delivered a mace from within him. The
> Yadavas were now struck with fear. They immediately rushed with the mace to
> Akroora and Ugrasena and in the presence of Krishna himself; they narrated
> the weird tide of events. Then they grind the bolt of iron and threw it
> into the sea.
>
> The town then witnesses several dark omens. Pests multiply. Sinful acts
> multiply, yet no one feels any shame. Everyone has the same terrifying
> dreams. People insult and humiliate their seniors and teachers. Krishna
> gets concerned, asks everyone to go on a pilgrimage to the sacred waters of
> the Prabhas sea. They do. When they arrive, the Yadavas revel in merry
> making, dance and drink lots of alcohol.
>
> They started teasing one another, bringing up the gory pasts and gruesome
> mistakes of each other. Satyaki and Krithavarma acted as the starting
> points of the doom of Dwaraka. Satyaki had fought on Pandava’s side in
> the battle of Kurukshetra and Krithavarma, on the Kaurava side. They
> taunted one another, bringing back memories of the horrific war. In rage,
> Satyaki, jumped on Krithaverma and cut his head off. The friends of
> Krithavarma pounced on Satyaki and a great brawl followed.
>
> Pradyumna, the son of Krishna, innocent though he was, found himself in
> the thick of the fight and was killed. As they have come to the sea shore
> for a pleasure, they did not carry any weapons along with them. They saw
> the long grown grass in abundance along the sea shore. They picked up the
> grass stems and beat and killed each other. Those grass stems were
> nothing but blades made of the powder of the same bolt of Iron born to
> Samba. Thus the curse of saints fructified.Each blade of grass became a
> mace, smashing into the Yadavas, killing them instantly. It was a matter of
> moments before the Yadavas lay dead, killed by their own clan members and
> in front of their very King. Except Krishna, all Yadavas were killed.
>
> Krishna’s charioteer Daruka and another one called Babhru only survived.
> Krishna asks Daruka to go to Pandavas, tell what had happened and ask
> Arjuna to come with help. Some of the powder cast in the Prabhas sea had
> been swallowed by a fish. Inside the fish, the powder has become a metal
> piece. Jara, a hunter, catches that fish and finds the metal. Jara
> sharpens it to make an arrow. He goes hunting, and accidentally shoots
> Krishna, while Krishna is meditating, thinking he is a deer. Krishna
> consoles Jara and then ascended with his four armed form to his abode.
> Reference:
> “Mausala Parva”
>
> *Q4 How was the divorce and widowhood system seen in the Sambandam
> concept of marriage in Kerala?*
>
> A4 Arun Mohan (*അരുൺ* *മോഹൻ**)*· January 9-2021 Lives in Kerala,
> India (2016–present)
>
> How was the divorce and widowhood system seen in the Sambandam concept of
> marriage in Kerala?I have made a detailed answer on the concept of
> Sambandham culture that prevailed among erstwhile upper castes of Hindu
> society of Kerala traditionally before it ended by 1940s-50s era
> completely.
>
> You can read my original answer on the concept of Sambandham as I don’t
> need to explain the system again here.
>
> Arun Mohan (*അരുൺ* *മോഹൻ**)*'s answer to What is Sambandham in Kerala?
>
> The basic tenant of Sambandham concept is consensus Live-in relationship.
> The basic concept of Marriage and husband-wife relationship or
> father-mother-children concept of family was not allowed among most of
> upper Hindu castes. *So the basic purpose of sexual relationships were to
> produce offsprings and beyond which there is no sanctity to the
> relationship*. So technically there was no marriage culture as such,
> rather it worked fully on live-in relationship style.
>
> The basic advantage of this system is commencement and termination of
> relationship at will and instantly. There were no huge rituals or process
> for start of this sort of relationship as well as end of this
> relationship as the society were both Polyandrous (women entering into
> sexual relationship as many as men as she likes) as well as Polygamous
> (men entering into sexual relationship with as many as women he likes).
>
> In a way, Sambandham system was much more sexually open system with no
> baggage of one-man/woman life time commitment etc. Due to this, many of
> traditional Hindu codes of chastity (Pavithratha) or marital vows or
> marriage concepts donot apply in Kerala context.
>
> As I said, Sambandham can be started quickly. In those days, Nair or
> Nampoothiri or Kshyatriya men in their trips around would identify ladies
> of higher castes/communities, normally in temples or any public places.
> When they like her, they may approach her uncle or mother at her family
> house. In some cases, they do directly approach to lady’s house out of
> intention to form an alliance with the family. Sambandham works only if
> lady’s uncle and senior members of family agree to it. If they agree, he
> will visit in evening soon after Sandyavandanam (lighting lamps for evening
> prayers) and offer a piece of cloth (Mundu/Dhoti) to the lady with whom he
> wish to enter into a sexual relationship. When the lady accepts the Mundu,
> the Sambandham has officially been commenced. The acceptance of Mundu
> from a man is called Pudamuri (Pudava means marital cloth and Muri means
> acceptance) and thats the official indication of start of sambandham.
>
> The lady is supposed to keep the Mundu with her until termination of
> Sambandham. The existence of Mundu signifies the ongoing Sambandham
> relationship. General rule was that, at a time, only one Sambandham can be
> done, but in Travancore side, it wasn’t that strict, so a lady can have
> multiple Sambandhams at a time. The only condition is that, she should
> remember, who gave which Mundu to her.
>
> One thing to note- Sambandham happens at woman’s own house. There was no
> legal marriage, so the lady will never leave her house. Rather the man
> who will be known as Sambandhakaran (or consort as in British English
> terminology records) lives in wife’s house as long as Sambandham goes on.
> Thats why the rule of One Sambandham at a time existed. If the love was
> much stronger, the Sambandham shall go forever and the man will live in
> wife’s house forever. However officially he will be an outsider in wife’s
> house and can’t own or manage wife’s properties. He can simply stay there
> and live there as long as the wife pleases OR till her natural death.
>
> In all ways, the so-called consort or man’s status in this relationship is
> always inferior to the status of woman. He was an outsider and never
> enjoyed any privilege or status in woman’s perspective.An old pic of Queen
> Sethu Parvathy Bai who sits in a throne like chair with her consort- Rama
> Varma Koyil Thampuran sitting on a stool to signify his lower position
>
> Now to the question-How divorce works in Sambandham?
>
> Its the most easiest process. Divorce is called Ozhimuri in Malayalam and
> under Sambandham, Ozhimuri, its very instant and quick. The lady has full
> right to decide whether she wants to continue the Sambandham or not as the
> relationship works under lady’s pleasure. The Sambandhakaran has no much
> say on this. If he doesn’t want to continue, he can cease visiting the
> lady’s house as he has no personal responsibility to the lady. But he
> can’t cancel Sambandham by himself. Whereas the lady can.
>
> For lady to cancel Sambandham, she has to simply return back the Mundu
> which was given during the start of Sambandham.
>
> The Ozhimuri customs is simple. The lady summons the Sambandhakaran, but
> won’t allow to enter into the house. Rather make him stand at the forecourt
> (Thirumuttum). Then either she or her maid will come out, give the mundu to
> Sambandharakan
> and shuts the main door in front of him. That signifies termination of
> Sambandham with that man and he must leave the house. He will have no
> more visiting rights to the lady’s house.Ozhimuri customs vary from region
> to region, though returning of Mundu is more common across Kerala. In
> Malabar side, 10 threads from Mundu is taken and its twisted in front of
> the Sambandhakaran and broken into two and thrown opposite sides. That
> means the relationship is broken forever. This custom is locally known as
> Noolacharam
> (Nool- Thread, Acharam- Ritual)
>
> In Kochi and Central Kerala side, Mundu is returned in hand and door is
> shut to signify Ozhimuri
>
> In Southern Kerala side, instead of Mundu, the betal leaf box of
> Sambandhakaran will be kept at the Padipura door (main gate door) by the
> maid when he makes a visit to the lady’s home. The act of keeping Betal
> Leaf box at the gate door signifies, he is no more welcome to the home and
> Sambandham has officially ceased. His personal effects will be also kept
> outside, which he can collect and leave.
>
> A scene from Malayalam movie- Ozhimuri when the martriach of the family
> decided to terminate her relationship with her Sambandakaran by placing
> betal leaf box outside the house that symbolizes end of relationship and he
> has to leave the house
>
> In all cases, Ozhimuri was arbitrary and fully decided on will of the lady.
>
> In case, both lady and Sambandhakaran continues the relationship forever
> and if the lady dies first, then an automatic Ozhimuri happens. In such
> case, the man loses his right to live in that house and must leave after
> completion of Pela period (16 days from date of death)How Widowhood system
> worked
>
> Well, there is no concept of widowhood among upper Hindu castes of Kerala
> in past(barring Tamil Brahmins and Nampoothiri ladies who follows
> Patriarchal rules)
>
> There was no marriage at first place, so how there will be widowhood in
> event of death of husband. Infact there was no husband itself. The man was
> called Sambandhakaran which means Consensual Mate or just a consort…
>
> Death of Sambandhakaran effects nothing to the lady and her children born
> to him as he was an outsider. Even the traditional mourning rules (Pela)
> will not apply over them as he was no one for them. He was just a
> consensual sexual partner only
>
> *This was one key reason, Kerala never had any concept of widowhood or its
> related issues*
>
> See, in traditional Hindu marriage codes, a Marriage means setting
> relationship for 7 lives, not just this life. Once a man and woman enters
> into a marriage relationship, it means both man and woman will serve each
> other for 7 lives. If husband dies first, she has to sacrifice all
> pleasures of life and fast till end of her life, to get back the same
> husband in next birth. That’s why widowhood was a big deal and created lot
> of tortures or hardships for widows in reality as they were supposed to
> fast to get back the same man as husband in next birth. Its for this
> reason, at the time of marriage, 7 steps/rounds are made around the sacred
> fire to signify the commitment made for 7 lives (Saath Janam ke Rishte as
> said in Hindi).
>
> This never worked in Kerala. Even today, Malayalee Hindus never do 7
> rounds around Fire (barring some communities like Nampoothiris or Tamil
> Brahmins etc) as we never enter into any marital vows of 7 lives. As a
> result, in Kerala Hindu culture (for all communities barring Nampoothiris),
> marriages are more of social contract prevailing between 2 individuals in
> this life time. Its never a matter of 7 lives. We never perform marriage in
> front of sacred fire (Agni) or invoke Agni thro’ a homam. In many
> traditional Indian marriages, the rational behind invoking Agni thro’ a
> Homam or a Havan etc is to have Agnideva (God of Fire who is also the
> divine messenger of gods) solemnizes marriages on earth on behalf of Gods.
> So only Agni can break a marital relationship (in form of cremation when
> Agni takes the body). Thats why widowhood concept do exist incase husband
> dies and wife stays back.
>
> But as Kerala never had sanctity for marriages, we never invoke Holy fire
> for Kerala marriages even today. As a result, none of the marriages are
> solemnized by Agni, hence no widowhood concept even today. Since 1940s,
> many North Indian concepts crept into Kerala system thro’ renaissance
> movement. So widowhood concept also came, but not severe or hard as one
> sees in North India, other than avoiding wearing Kumkum on forehead or
> bright color sarees (that too now reduced).
>
> In Sambandham times, there was no Widowhood concept among those who
> observes.
>
> Saying so, this wasn’t applied to Nampoothiri community who followed
> typical patriarchal rules as seen in North India. So Namboothiri women
> seriously suffered horrors of widow hood and never had liberty of easy
> divorce at will
>
> My note- Many Tamil iyers came to Kerala had relations with nayars at one
> time. Irrespective of what is told above due to the relations lot of landed
> properties they could get from nairs. The children born had high regard
> to father iyer. Even in my college days I knew of such relations in
> central Kerala.
>
> *Q5 What are interesting facts about Parad Shivling?*
>
> A5 Dev Kumar January 1-2021 Former Teacher. Have you ever notice
> the Structure of Bhaba Atomic Research Centre BARC resembles like a
> Shivling ?
>
> Water continuously flows through nuclear reactor to keep it cool. A water
> pot is a always placed over shivling to pour water on it continuously. The
> function of Shivalinga is very close to a nuclear reactors which generates
> universally present energy which we call the energy of Shiva, which is
> unlimited and divine. The modern day nuclear reactor is an inspiration of
> that energy creation.
>
> The water comes out from the Shivling is never consumed. Also no one is
> allowed to cross the spout during padakshina.
>
> Just like that the water released from the nuclear reactor cannot be
> consumed as it polluted with radiation
>
> All the above QA are based on Quora digest to me on 16-1-2021. Quora
> answers need not be 100% correct answers
>
> *Compiled and posted by R. Gopala krishnan on 16-1-2021*
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "iyer123" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to [email protected].
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/iyer123/308385220.1798611.1610810365902%40mail.yahoo.com
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/iyer123/308385220.1798611.1610810365902%40mail.yahoo.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> .
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
> "iyer123" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an
> email to [email protected].
> To view this discussion on the web visit
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/iyer123/255829067.189178.1610849357832%40mail.yahoo.com
> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/iyer123/255829067.189178.1610849357832%40mail.yahoo.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>
> .
>
--
You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups
"Thatha_Patty" group.
To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email
to [email protected].
To view this discussion on the web visit
https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/thatha_patty/CAL5XZorEnaTXKQ8JHGKV5cLApSH8WD37ApMVX%3D8Ckj8gHd8%3DMw%40mail.gmail.com.
