> > R: Your Tiddler turns to mush when dragged and dropped to my TW. > >> T: Well, that's pretty obvious if you grab one that constructs its >> contents via the list macro or something making use of that. ^^ >> Not quite sure why you'd actually import it. I could possibly make a >> ListOfTBStuffPlugin but then I don't quite see how interesting that would >> be. >> A swarm would surely come-in handy here for you to grab those tids. > > R Reply: A swarm would definitely help here. I was grabbing this to add to the Hangouts as I feel it is best to have people define themselves. So if you have an "about" page I was grabbing that Tiddler and putting it in my TW to avoid having to make server calls to another server. That is why I wanted to create a twCard I called a <Name Plate> - Something you can easily copy that follows a standard so we all have similar data with no macros or plugins. I am going to explore iframes to allow people to create their own definition of themselves and I will just point at it, again my concern is Server Calls and disappearing data. My <Name Plate> <http://www.richshumaker.com/tw5/TiddlyWiki-Hangouts.html#Rich%20Shumaker> uses an audio file, a macro(linkimg) and a few images and none of those are baked into the Tiddler so they are lost when you drag and drop. I was exploring what people might want to describe themselves, such as an alias or nickname, an avatar, a pronunciations of their name and an image of themselves as some examples.
R: Yesterday I was grabbing something on Delete Button in ViewMode there > was a transclusion that didn't come with the Tiddler and it was a TOBIAS > WARNING so it was important. > >> T: Yes, that's pretty much what I need to do, if I want to be able to >> reuse these things. Maybe, one day, dragging a reference that transcludes >> stuff will actually create those adhoc-swarms pulling along all the other >> pieces that are required for the thing to nearly render the way you see it. > > R Reply: I am looking for an intermediary step, Not Full HTML but not full macro and Plug In required to render. Something that would be a Rendered TW Tiddler that is the size of a Tiddler but includes data from Plug Ins, Macros, Transclusions, and other stuff. > R: My question is a bigger one that I was not being specific with > you(Tobias) but since I grab your stuff the most I seem to witness it the > most with your stuff. > >> T: I can sure see how that's happening. > > R: Jed's stuff does it to me as well. > >> T: Perhaps you're expecting a little (too) much. After all, you're moving >> about another site and expect to just grab stuff and repurpose. It's not >> that I am against that, but did you ever try that on some other >> conventional site? ^^ >> T: So, manually figuring out what's missing and then getting that "stuff" >> is actually easily done... you just need to pay a little closer attention >> to what it is you actually want. > > R Reply: Yes I will explore grabbing things by hand more. I was looking for a way to not 'miss' things. Jed's stuff often are things he wants you to grab, try and use. I have run into issues as there are hidden things that are referenced(or un-referenced) and can be missed. I am looking for a way for creators of stuff to create and not worry will I be able to recreate it easily. So if you build 'Thing One' and then later build 'Thing Two' you could have added something on 'Thing One' that is used by 'Thing Two' so you don't even think about including it when you post a swarm or JSON of 'Thing Two'. R Reply Part 2: From a conventional site I have Liked it, Bookmarked it, Printed it to paper, Printed to PDF, WGet'd it, and of course lost it completely(data loss or site disappearance). I am looking for a longer term solution that will allow me to keep things for longer than a hot minute. Data loss is something that has occurred for me since my C64 days as technology changes and things like Zip Drive Click Death occurs. Backups are necessary and TiddlyWiki has a very helpful method for keeping things long term by being able to clone small portions and whole data sets. I have lost the least data using TiddlyWiki and that is why I am exploring ways to move data around and not missing or losing things. I can see a need for me to move my own stuff around without having to think about all the stuff I used to build it. R: I know there is an advanced search methodology that can be done and I > have used it many times, I am just not good at it. > Is there some search method that could be done on a Tiddler to find all > the things it links to both as Macros and Transclusions and other necessary > files? > >> T: Oftentimes, you can just grab that filter as declared for some list >> and there you have your "dependencies". >> As for dependencies on macros or plugins, that's not as easy... you need >> to know or figure out "how things tick". >> You really need to know what is being used and figure out where it's >> coming from... or ask. > > R Reply: I understand. That is why I am exploring this concept so that creators including myself don't have to remember all the stuff they used and did as sometimes it is in the background. R: Something like Tiddler + Macro and Tiddler + Transclusion and Tiddler + > Other Stuff?(Not sure how that would be formatted) > The JSON method for import is AMAZING and I am working on that more and > more everyday. > >> T: You see, I'm thinking so long as that author of the stuff you'd like >> to get isn't telling you how to easily get it... maybe it's simply not >> designed to be easily gettable... but just to be "consumable" as is. I >> mean, after all, you can always link to that content, rather than >> copy-pasta. > > R Reply: So that leads to a really good question, how do you protect things in TW5verse if you don't want it consumed? Can you block the drag and drop of data? I find the drag and drop of Tiddlers to be one of the strongest TW5 features. Not many things have this ability and none at the level of TW5. As they often say, 'That is not a bug, it is a feature' and in this case I feel that phrase fits TW5 drag and dropability very well. That is another reason I was exploring in other threads a way to do 'track backs'. In social networks you might be able to track back 1 maybe 2 levels. Wouldn't it be cool if you could easily track back a TW5 Tiddler all the way to the start. So I drag and drop a Tiddler by Tobias, then 5 other levels do the same thing and you can still tell that Tobias created this and it traveled this path to get to another page. I think this is very important for the long term of social data sharing no matter what platform, who grabbed what and shared it with who. R: I was actually trying to avoid importing all the Tiddlers so I guess I > can export the Tiddler as an HTML and import it into mine but that will > bloat my TW code. > >> T: Precisely. So, do you really need all that... and, if so, why and in >> which form? > > R Reply: Typically I just need the data so I can Copy and Paste the text. This is just less than elegant as it loses the links and other useful things. Having all the Macro's and PlugIns is not necessary or wanted most times. As I said above I was looking for an inbetween step or 'rendered' Tiddler that are the size of a Tiddler with all the data from the the Macro's, Plug In's, Transclusions and other things baked in. R: Is is possible to use TiddlyClip to import all the necessary stuff > somehow? > >> T: It would be as difficult for TiddlyClip as it would be for any other >> TiddlyFoo, core or plugin or whichever. > > R Reply: Thanks as always Tobias for all your help with this and many things. I will explore the iFrame option for the hangouts to point to people's site for their bio data. That way if they update their site that will automatically update to my site. Rich Shumaker -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "TiddlyWikiDev" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. 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