Agree ... it involves lots of separate instruction. This is one reason why we developed separate class for computer use as companion to our research methods class. Students take Stats, after or with a required Sci Foundation class that reviews major methods supposedly covered in Intro Psych. Then they take Experimental Psych along with the Computer class. We had emphasized SAS, but are now giving them SPSS. ALL of these should be stressing apa format also. After this sequence, they may then take lab classes (requiring all of above) where they work further on class activities/projects involving research design, stats, and apa write-up specific to areas. Sounds good ? but, still, it is the special student who becomes really well versed in SPSS, and goes on to do indep research with faculty. Such folks should be able to handle and learn more in grad program....IF they can get in any these days ha. Anyway, just one effort to deal with covering stats programs.
G.L. (Gary) Peterson,Ph.D Psychology@SVSU On Aug 8, 2012, at 11:23 PM, Paul C Bernhardt <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > This is my opinion, also. Using SPSS, or any other program, with all our > undergraduates is generally not a good idea. The reason that I feel that way > is that I have plenty to do to teach them how to understand concepts and > context. I'm also usually teaching them how to write in APA style. So, if I > add to that a statistics package, I have to teach them how to use that > package. That is a lot of time spent trying to metaphorically teach the > student how to start and put into first gear a high performance race car when > all they really need to know is how to drive a regular road car with a manual > transmission and then write an accurate description of that process. I don't > want to teach fewer research/statistical concepts and less about writing just > to teach about software that does what they learn from their book how to do > by hand. If the student is outstanding enough to be going to a Ph.D. or > Masters with thesis program, the student is clever enough to learn SPSS in > the instruction they get in graduate school. I know that we did special > instruction in its use because that was my TA position for two semesters, > teaching how to use SPSS and BMDP. > > Paul > > On Aug 8, 2012, at 9:13 PM, Michael Scoles wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> When I was in graduate school, folks from the clinical wing would suck it up >> and come visit with us rat runners with the following question (stated in >> different ways). I've got the printout from BMDP from my dissertation data. >> Do any of you people down here know what it means. >> >> I resist using SPSS to teach statistics until the most advanced graduate >> courses. If they can perform simple computations on a calculator, and more >> complex ones with the help of Excel, they might have a chance of >> understanding what those SPSS outputs mean. >> >> >> >> >> Michael T. Scoles, Ph.D. >> Associate Professor of Psychology & Counseling >> University of Central Arkansas >> Conway, AR 72035 >> 501-450-5418>>> Marc Carter <[email protected]> 6/6/2012 12:35 PM >>> >> Hi, All -- >> >> A little unscientific poll for you. >> >> We consider our program to be a grad-school-prep program, and have been >> doing pretty heavy instruction in SPSS, thinking that when the students get >> to grad school that's the package they're most likely to encounter. >> >> That was certainly my experience a few years ago, but I'm wondering if we're >> thinking right, today. Should we move to a different stats package, or is >> SPSS still pretty common. >> >> Since IBM bought it it's gone through some changes and seemed headed much >> more toward business applications, but this last year they seemed to realize >> that schools were a large part of their clientele, and have made pricing a >> little more reasonable (although still hideously expensive). Here the >> departments that want that package buy it (IT decided to cut its budget by >> pushing things off onto departments), and so I want to do right by my >> students, but have to think "thrifty." >> >> So, the poll: for those of you who work in departments that have grad >> programs, what stats software packages are available to your students? >> >> Thanks! >> >> m >> >> -- >> Marc Carter, PhD >> Associate Professor of Psychology >> Chair, Department of Behavioral and Health Sciences >> College of Arts & Sciences >> Baker University >> -- >> >> >> >> The information contained in this e-mail and any attachments thereto >> ("e-mail") is sent by Baker University ("BU") and is intended to be >> confidential and for the use of only the individual or entity named above. >> The information may be protected by federal and state privacy and >> disclosures acts or other legal rules. 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