*************
The following message is relayed to you by [email protected]
************
Hi Slim,
I was interested in finding the post that was the original and then
the reply post. In looking to sort this out, I noticed a structure
that I couldn't explain. Essentially the email structure shows that
the email is from you and then shows that there are answers to the
email but the answers-email has no signature. So my curiosity is,
from where and from whom are the answers from. The TROM index shows
as SPE. I could not find any posting that is independent and has
answers to your post that was posted to TROM. Just the two with this
subject and the strange structure. One post is from SPE and the
other from TROM but they are both pretty much the same. The funny
thing is that your original post looks like the reply response.
Help me out with this please. In the mean time I will reply but I do
wind up answering both your post and the replies to it.
On Jul 25, 2012, at 10:50 PM, [email protected] wrote:
Greeting !!
if you take a charged car battery which has a positive and
negative ( know, not know ) set of terminals and touch them
together what happens?
crack !! sparks, heat and smoke etc.
this is the same kind of charge you go after and null or time
break out in the mind. Its a must vs mustn't . a positive vs
negative. know vs not know.
Without a positive there can be no negative the positive always
comes first .
Just as a correction only to the statement of 'which comes first'.
Both must come into being at the same time for one cannot exist
without the other. It's like the conundrum of the which comes first,
the chicken or the egg. The answer is they both come into being/
existence at the same time. Due to the definition and the working of
the system, whether polarities or chickens and eggs, one cannot be
defined without the other and neither definition can not stand alone
with only one part of the definition/system. Yes it is a riddle if
you want to look at it as such but the answer to the riddle is as
simple as the riddle itself, they both come into existence at the
same time for one cannot exist without the other.
the neg is always drawn to positive and the positive never draws
to the neg.
This is a viewpoint which is taken by making one item stationary. If
one switches the viewpoint as to which is stationary the one that
gets drawn to the other is also changed.
The losing valence always goes into the winning valence. ALWAYS.
you'll never see a winner go into a losing valence.
. the universe becomes very simple to understand once you have the
basics.
the Mind is a dual universe construct. It doesn't exist outside of
this universe the way it does within the universe. It's exclusive
to this universe. Not the spiritual being.
You are making contradicting statements here. You say the mind is a
construct of a dual universe which I take as meaning of and/or from
two universes (I presume this to mean the spiritual and physical
universes). You then go on to say that its existence outside of this
universe (I presume to be the MEST Universe and therefore existence
in the spiritual universe) is in a different way to the universe
which I again presume to be the MEST Universe. Now the contradiction
which is the statement that it, the mind is exclusive to this
universe (I presume you mean the MEST Universe) and from that I then
take it that you now say the mind only exists in the MEST Universe.
You end with a further clarification "Not the spiritual being" which
is an incomplete sentence and idea and I presume you mean to say ...
'Not exclusive to the spiritual being'. From that I would take it
that you are saying there is more than just the spiritual being that
has a mind and if we are talking about a particular mind, a specific
then that 'now' mutual' mind could be no other than the mind of the
physical identity of which, the spiritual being is being in the MEST
Universe.
Funny how no one ever seems to comment on the big white elephant
sitting quietly in the middle of the living room .
If you would state what that 'big white elephant' is, I would be able
to know whether this statement is true or not.
Its the white elephant called the basic law of the universe. . A
law that prevents knowing . a law that prevents knowing a thing
that exists outside of this universe.
This is getting a little closer but now I would like to know which or
what 'basic law of the universe' you are talking about.
It prohibits knowing things until AFTER things have been created
in this universe. It prohibits knowing things before the
creation. But only applies while one considers themselves within
this universe.
I don't think that would apply to things I create. I have an idea, a
concept and then I produce the creation. Therefore I know before my
creations come into being. I think this knowing of mine, of my
creation before I create it would be true of any universe I was in.
It prevents knowing things prior to the creation of this universe
since its peculiar to this universe and the creation of this
universe. It prevents knowing things outside of this universe
while in it. since anything created outside of this universe is
not subject to this basic law and the rest of the laws of this
universe. But as long as you abide by this law, no thing can be
known outside this universe while in it as it is not part of or
created within this universe. So it can not be known. It's a
different space and time dimension. Space and time of this
universe to not apply to any other universe. Including anything
created outside of this universe.
This is all very nice about this 'basic law' but as long as we have
no idea what 'it' is, there is no way to know if what you are saying
is true. I personally do not go along with the idea that there is
something that I cannot know. The only thing that I cannot know is
that which I choose to not know. The funny thing about that is, that
I would have to initially know what it is in order to then ... not
know what it is. The 1st postulate is 'Not Know'. Therefore I can
only know things that I then choose to not know. Or I must have
known things that I now choose to not know otherwise how could I
choose not to know them.
Its a very nicely hidden trap. Whats a better trap than a trap
that is hidden from view ? One doesn't even know where to look
for it, as its almost impossible to find or know of its existence.
The irony is that it's sitting right in front of your face. Like a
big white elephant sitting in the middle of your living room.
This is true because traps get their power and trapping ability from
the Thetan/spirit. As long as one is trapped, it is because one is
choosing to be trapped and choosing not to know. When one comes to
the ability to look and to therefore know, he becomes un-trapped.
This is the basic of all mind therapies. Look, confront, know and
handle. If this were not true (but it has been demonstrated to be
true and workable thru several therapies) then none of the therapies
would produce any results at all.
Its a mystery that goes unsolved from lifetime to lifetime . A
body can die and the being can check out , but the spiritual being
can never leave.
I'm lost, never leave what?
Wheres one to go when one considers this universe the only place
there is. You can leave of you want to but you better know you can
first .
http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x1971g_eagles-hotel-california_music
Some will have you convinced that there's only the MEST universe
and prior to that was and is no thing. no place no where else.
JUST the mest universe. Just this one.
One may just consider, why bother looking else where since this is
the ONLY universe. Others may have you believe there's an outer
universe that traps beings in this one. Total BS. Lol . Don't let
anyone try to convince you of it.
A spiritual being can only be trapped this way by consideration. .
You cant grab a being by its arm and say where do you think you're
going pal ? Can you ? All one can do is convince others.
You wont have any advantage over humans knowing the true nature of
this universe either. You'll only get so far with it, but as long
as you're in it, you'll be bound by its laws just like the guy in
the car next to you .
Its nothing more than a know / not know dual structured universe.
The four basic abilities are abilities that are peculiar to this
universe NOT the spiritual being. These four abilities are the
ONLY basic abilities a spiritual being has while considering
itself within this universe.
What are those 4 basic abilities? If you could, please tell me/us
what those are.
Knowing the creator of this universe or how the creator came to be
is in direct violation of the basic law that governs this universe.
From this I can see that I and we do know the creator of this
universe but because of this 'law' we are into not knowing who the
creator is. I for myself then know that I know and am able to
therefore know what I know. For me to not know is just a postulate
of mine to not know. At any time I can then choose to know by
postulate, law or no law.
Since the creator came before the creation of this universe and is
outside of this universe , it can not be known until you leave this
universe.
I don't believe that to be true. I believe I can know as a spirit,
who is being an identity, a being, a human in the MEST Universe at
the same time that I know that I am a spirit. I will say that
knowing is exclusive to the Thetan/spirit. It is not a MEST, body or
brain function at all. So if there is any knowing at all (as well as
not knowing) that is a function of the Thetan/spirit only. That
being so, I don't see that there is a MEST Universe 'law' that could
ever have any effect on the Thetan/spirit unless the Thetan/spirit
decided that it be so. MEST Universe laws pertain only to MEST/
physical things.
There can only be theories but can not be directly known while in
this universe.
That means that I as a Thetan/spirit am controlled and policed by the
MEST Universe and I say, that can never happen unless I choose for it
to be so by postulate of course and then it will only be true for me
under that circumstance. Others if they wish may choose that to be
true for them but only by their choosing.
Once outside this universe or any other universe, there are no
limitations upon the spiritual being . it can know do be have see
look anything on and on and on, you name it . its possible into
infinity . no limits.
here's a quote from the Games manual . The original Game Manual at
the
www.resolutionofmind.org
Quote :
I offer you a route out. There may well be other routes out; if
there are I know not of them after many lifetimes of searching.
The fortuitous combination of games matrix and circumstances that
permitted me to discover this route at this time may not ever
happen to me again; and others too could easily overlook it. So
don?t lose this data, for it may be many lifetimes before you come
across it again - if you ever do.
The data is quite free. I only ask two things:
1) You use the data.
2) When you duplicate the data, you duplicate it exactly. Not
because I am enamored with my prose style, but because altered it
could very easily become just another trap in a universe already
abundantly endowed with them.
End quote .
Slim
--
Have a nice day : )
Here is a quote from LRH:
“Being trapped in this universe is something on the order of being
caught in a matchbox. You know, here’s this huge, powerful
individual and he’s standing there outside the matchbox looking at
the matchbox saying, ‘Boy, I wonder how I’ll ever get out of that
matchbox.’ This is the silly aspect which life presents to
individuals."
“All right. We cannot erase or as-is, make a perfect duplicate of
freedom. [So] You make a perfect duplicate of nothing and you will,
of course, still have the same thing you started out with—nothing.”
Now compare this to TROM or auditing. You make a perfect duplicate
of something, if from the mind, a something that has charge and any
un-truth to it ... and compare it to a similar something in present
time or just look at that something in present time and the charge
will discharge against the object in present time and the charge will
go away. Then one can compare the something with the present time
object and note similarities and differences and by doing that one
can discharge the A = A = A = A modus operandi. Then one will have
discarded the prior way of seeing things and realize that way was a
false aberrated way of looking at and seeing things. With these two
exercises from TROM, one then eliminates that earlier aberative
action altogether. Imbedded in Scn auditing is the same phenomena.
It is Level 2 and 3 in TROM.
Now one can simply see, see what is there, see truth and not mask it
with falsities and thereby aberrations. This then also avails one of
as-isness by inspection, the as-isness of past BS and the non-
creation and introduction of present and future aberrations. Simply,
one is becoming 'Cleared'. As one continues in Life, they also
continue to de-aberrate, one Clears themself by now seeing and
continuing to see only what is there. The mind is no longer a player
at all.
If anyone is on Level 4, I will be glad to expand on that Level and
what that step does in continuing the Clearing process.
Paul/Level 5 in progress
_______________________________________________
Trom mailing list
[email protected]
http://lists.newciv.org/mailman/listinfo/trom
