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Currently Florida
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004
22:35
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] 613
Commands
In a message dated 11/16/2004 4:00:10 PM
Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Jeff in Red:
----- Original Message -----
From: Jeff Powers
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 5:19
Subject: Re:
[TruthTalk] 613 Commands
John, start with Acts 15.
Realizing that Gentiles coming into the faith presented a problem for
fellowship with Jewish believers, the council established the BARE MINIMUM
of requirements in order that Gentiles could fellowship with Jews.
Then verse 21 tells us that in time these gentiles would learn Torah. This
evening I'll try to expand on this. I don't have time this
morning.
Jeff
----- Original Message -----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 21:59
Subject: Re:
[TruthTalk] 613 Commands
In a message dated 11/15/2004
5:09:53 AM Pacific Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED]
writes:
And there is no difference
between God's commandments
and Jesus' commandments.
1) Does not
your view of the commandments include holy days, and imperatives that
involve all of the Mosaical Law with the exception of the sacrifical
laws? Yes John. But when we learn the commandments we see that
many do not apply to each one of us. Of those that do apply we are to
follow the example of Yeshua and obey them. I find it interresting
that the reason mankind cannot keep Torah is the fact that we CHOOSE not
to be obedient. Yes, I include myself in this statement. Is it
possible to obey all of Torah, yes.
2) Since I am a
Gentile -- where in scripture is Mosaical Law bound upon me in
Jesus? I guess that depends on how you view Yeshua. Is He not
the Lamb of God, the Passover Lamb? Thats what 1Cor. 5:7 tells us. Or
John 1:29 &1:36. I realize this is a bit worn out (sort of),
but WWJD? Look at the gospel accounts and tell me how many time the
Passover is mentioned and in what context? You will see that Yeshua and
his Talmidim are observing Passover. Hmm, If Yeshua celebrates
Passover shouldn't we? So let me throw these at you and ask that
you explain to me what they mean to you: Exodus 12:19,12:48 (remembering
that the Jerusalem Council did away with this one. Though we may have to
discuss this one in detal later, lets skip the bloodshed for now!),
Exodus 12:49, 20:10, 23:12, 16:29, Leviticus 16:29, 17:8-15, 19:34,
there are a lot more in Lev. but I think you can understand the point
here. Numbers 9:14, 15:14, A real biggie in this context, Numbers
15:15,"The community is to have the same rules for you and the alien
living among you; this is a lasting ordinance for the generations to
come. You and the alien shall be the same before YHVH. THE SAME LAWS AND
REGULATIONS WILL APPLY BOTH TO YOU AND TO THE ALIEN LIVING AMONG
YOU." If you really want I can go on and on, but as James said in
the decision in Acts 15:21, "Moses is taught in the assemblies each
Sabbath..." (My translation), the meaning of this verse is that Gentiles
coming into the Kingdom of YHVH would learn the Torah in bite sized
portions and begin to apply Torah as YHVH moved them. I believe we
have made the point clear that you and I agree that the Father and the
Son are one and the same so this shouldn't be too difficult. One
point I almost forgot, depending on your translation, Gentile may be
translated, stranger, alien, foreigner, gentile, etc. from the
Hebrew.
3) Am I nonetheless a brother in Christ ?
Definitely Yes, I look forward to personally meeting you,
if not in this time then in the world to come!!
Jeff
John
Thanks,
Jeff. And thanks fro taking the time. What part
of the country is home?
John
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