Re: [TruthTalk] Perry & Dave: inquiring minds want to know

[Dave Hansen]

If I lack insight and make wrong assumptions, Dave, set me straight. DAVEH:   I've tried to do that in times past, Perry.  But despite what I say, you believe what you want to, irregardless of the truth.  Your intent seems not to care about what LDS theology teaches, but rather you want to destroy LDS theology.  Am I perceiving your agenda correctly, Perry? Charles Perry Locke wrote: If I lack insight and make wrong assumptions, Dave, set me straight. You will not talk about Temple rituals because you have taken oaths not to, and have been told of the penalties that you will endure of you reveal them, like having your throat cut from ear to ear, or having you belly cut and your intestines spilled on the ground (if I am in error heere please correct me by revealing tthe correct penalties), just like the Masons (who incorporated gripd, signs, tokens, and epnealties long before JS was a mason) from which parts of the mormon temple ceremonies were copied. So, I must rely on ex-mormons who have been brought into the light, left the mormon cult, and now reveal the rituals that are performed inside the temple. The mormon temple rites are no different than any secret organization...the cultic structure is very obvious. So, if you don't know what "pay lay ale" means, then I guess I must turn to those who do, and will admit it.   The only truth is the Word of God, Dave, something the mormons pay lip service to, but set aside for the works of the false prophet JS. You can certainly tell me all day that I do not have the truth, but can you demonstrate that? Perry DAVEH:   It is posts like this that confirm my presumption that you lack understanding, perception and truth, Perry.   I understand your need to /wing it/, so to speak, in an effort to by chance hit a soft spot in my armor.  Instead, as I see it by making incorrect assumptions, you are simply proving your lack of insight. Charles Perry Locke wrote: Dave,   My ultimate concern is that if you are raising your hands and chanting words that you do not understand, you may be invoking that which you presume you are not. That is the key to whom you owe your allegiance. If you are not sure, or do not know exactly what that means, where it came from, what language it is in, and to whom you are praying when you do that, then when you get to the deepest part of your ritual, in the deepest part of your temple, and perform signs and chant those words, nothing else said or believed outside of that moment defines your religion. You are invoking who you invoke.   On the other hand, if you know that you are invoking Satan, or anyone or anything other than God, and you wish to do that, then I have no argument with your faith. You are free to do that as long as you know what you are doing, and choose to continue it. (Actually, you are free to do it blindly, too, if you wish. But if you are, pleading ignorance at your jusgement will not be a valid excuse, "...they [men] are without excuse" - Romans 1).   You and millions of other mormons may not really know what is going on at that moment. You may be doing it just because someone told you that is the thing to do, or because you think, "If it happens in the temple it can't be wrong". Think again, Dave. Think about exactly what is it that you are doing and saying at that moment. If your leaders cannot answer the questions with certainty and proof of their meaning, rather than with side-steps and cute answers, then you just may be paying homage to something other than the God you think you are invoking. Do you know for sure? Your burning bosom can't answer that question. I will pray for your deliverance, and the deliverance of your family, and all mormons, that the veil of darkness will be lifted and the light of Jesus Christ will shine in. Perry -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.