Questions (and admittedly, I am more of a novice on this point of doctrine than most):
1. At what point in Luke's genealogy does the list cease to be Jewish?
2. If redemption of the world is through the Chosen People of God and Christ, for a number of reasons, was the embodiment of the Chosen - it seems to my way of thinking that this reasoning would support
the idea that the People of God (Jews) were never anything other than the Chosen and that would include Adam and Eve.
3. so, I guess I would be saying that Christ's lineage includes all of the Chosen through Adam to God - and that Christ is tied to the rest of the creation (all of mankind) as the Creator. He is the common tie, not the blood line. It is in Him that Jew and Gentile, male and female vanish.
4. Biblical considerations include this thought: I believe that the "mystery" of the gospel is identified as the inclusion of all of mankind - that this was hidden from the Chosen until revealed in Christ. It seems to me that Mark 4:11 ff has Christ speaking of the salvation of all ( in several parables) - not just the salvation of the Jew AND the blindness of the Jew to this notion with Romans 11:25 making this commentary specific and, even, irresistible ---- reaffirmed in Ro 16:25-26 and, again in Eph 3:4-6.
Such a belief finds you and I accepting the same premise - Christ dying for the world , as a representative of mankind ( as the Creator - jd) and , at the same time, fulfilling this purpose as the Israel of God [hence his blood line through Adam to God (as God) ]
Your friend,
John
If I am wrong on this, I really need someone (esp Bill) to hang in there with me, let me make my points, and deal with my argumentation empathetically. I can handle being disagreed by friends. So -- sock it to me !!
-----Original Message-----
From: Taylor <wmtaylor@plains.net>
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 04:19:48 -0700
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] New Subject-A&E
I think probably, John, that all humanity had to have come through Adam and Eve. This does not mean that Cain and then Abel had to have been their first children (I guess), but in order for Christ to be the go'el or Kinsmen Redeemer of mankind, there has to have been a common ancestry, i.e., a common bloodline. That is the significance of Luke taking Jesus' genealogy all the way back to Adam: Christ therefore as the Second Man was qualified to represent everyone represented by the first man.
Bill
----- Original Message -----From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]Sent: Thursday, December 08, 2005 10:27 PMSubject: Re: [TruthTalk] New Subject-A&ESo Cain and Abel were children # 1 and #2. and when Cain killed Able -- who was he afraid of -- I mean, where did those people come from? I personally believe that Adam and Eve were not the only people created. But that is not a popular opinion. If we go with the standard opin -- Cain was afraid of his own people!!!!jd
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org
Sent: Fri, 9 Dec 2005 00:20:07 EST
Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] New Subject-A&EIn a message dated 12/8/2005 8:27:46 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:But why did they not have children until they were 1) changed into mortal beingsI hate to tell you this B but the children generally come NINE Months AFTER the FACT!Blainerb: Hmm, let's see, chapter three of Genesis ends with the couple being driven out of the paradisiacal garden, then chapter 4 begins as follows:"And Adam knew Eve his wife, and she conceived, and bare Cain, and said, I have gotten a man from the Lord."Sounds like the fun began AFTER leaving the garden!!!! But no timetable is given.
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Blainerb: Ha! I agree, it was a good commandment! But why did they not have children until they were 1) changed into mortal beings, and 2) forced out of the garden?In a message dated 12/8/2005 7:46:18 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:I wasn't there Blaine. If you don't like it, complain to God. He ordered it, not me. I do, however, think it was a great idea. One of the easiest commands to keep. ;-)
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Are you saying Adam and Eve were capable of having sex prior to the Fall?? What sacrilege is this?? :>)BlainerbIn a message dated 12/8/2005 6:48:37 P.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:I think you might have missed something, Blaine. There is no reason to think that Judy would not have been here if there had been no fall. The command to "Be fruitful and multiply" came prior to the fall. See Genesis 1:28.
Terry
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:Blainerb: You seem to be forgetting how wonderful you as a daughter of God are, Judy. Without Adam and Eve's partaking of the forbidden fruit, none of us including your wonderful self would even be here--Adam and Eve would just be lounging around in their perfect little paradise, never knowing good from evil and not even caring. But they would be eternally pure and goody-good righteous.. Is that what you think the Lord really wanted?In a message dated 12/8/2005 3:41:54 A.M. Mountain Standard Time, [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:The trees in the garden DaveH are the two kinds of wisdom. The tree of life is "pure, peaceable, and full of good fruit" and this is the tree God wanted His creation to eat from. The other tree - the one the serpent was promoting - is earthly, sensual, and demonic. So take your pick. One leads to life and the other to death.
judyt
He that says "I know Him" and doesn't keep His Commandments
is a liar (1 John 2:4)
