Judy, God's covenant with Abraham was not contractual in nature. His
promise(s) in that case was sovereign and apart from Abraham's efforts.

Not the whole truth JD. I know he and Sarah produced an Ishmael by works of

the flesh; but what if Abraham had refused to "believe" God and leave UR?

Without faith it is impossible to please Him - is this not a condition?

In (Romans 3:28.) We share in the very same promise.

Yes and we have the same fear and faith confronting us as Abraham

did with the same spiritual consequences.

The greek thing (eis) has everything to do with the discussion at hand....

Possibly the "in Christ" idea which I believe (eis) is BT's scholarly way of

saying.

your opinions on that subject aside. In the Galatians passage, we
are immersed INTO Jesus Christ.......and thus "hid in Christ"

(Gal 3:26,27 and Col 3:3).

Let's see "For ye are all the children of God by faith in Christ Jesus"

Gal 3:26 (same condition) and Col 3:2 "Set your affection on things

above, not on things on the earth" IOW be spiritually minded which

is a faith action and is also a condition.

Now, if you want to isolate a single biblical thought regarding judgment,
be my guest - but I think the student/disciple is much better served
as she considers all of scripture AND allows scripture to say what it says.

Judgment is part of what it says JD and there is much more than one

single scripture, in fact Jesus spoke about judgment more than he

spoke about heaven.

Most of us fail to struggle with reconciling one passage with another. It is
not "reconciliation" to prefer one passage and IGNORE the others. The result
of such studies is a redactive theology that is meaningless (IMHO>) jd

I don't have to do the above JD because I have nothing to hide, nothing to protect,

and no theologian to defend. I like all scripture equally, every Word of God because

these are life to those who find them and health to all their flesh.

-------------- Original message ----------------------
From: Judy Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> JD
> 2 Cor 5:10.11 is written by the same apostle as the scriptures you have
> posted below and believe me he never ever speaks out of both sides of his
> mouth ATST - this is our problem - not his because 2 Cor 5:10,11 was
> written by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and it stands.
>
> Trying to mix scripture with metaphysics and philosophy is the problem
> here. This is akin to trying to mix oil with water; it is attempting to
> conform God's Living Word to some man's dead theology. The letter kills
> but the Spirit gives life - so we must not forget the ifs, ands, and
> buts; because all of God's covenants are conditional and there is not a
> thing wrong with his eyesight. We can not be walking in sin and walking
> in the "righteousness of Christ" at the same time. The condition for
> walking free from condemnation is "walking after the spirit and not
> fulfilling the lust of the flesh" When we choose carnal thinking and
> fleshly pursuits we make ourselves God's enemy which means we are not
> free from sin and where there is sin there is also judgment.
>
> As for this (eis) business and the "ontology" some refer to constantly -
> this has nothing at all to do with God's revelation
> and is best left in Greek antiquity with Aristotle and his Metaphysics
> judyt
>
> On Fri, 17 Mar 2006 06:23:52 +0000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
> Col 3:3 -- our very lives are hid in Christ. God looks to the
> righteousness of Christ and it is in this righteousness that we are
> hidden.
>
> Christ's sacrifice is once and for all time -- emphasis here on "once."
> It is offered only once because in that offering our sins are fully
> remitted (Heb 10:18).   There can be no judgment , of the person, if
> there is no sin.
>
> And II Cor 5: 21 tells us that we have become the righteousness of God IN
> Christ --   a positional circumstance in this case.
>
> Gal 3:26-27 As many as have been immersed into Christ have put on
> Christ. We are "in" (eis) the very ontology of Son of God and are
> becoming like Him in terms of faith and righteousness. Our personal
> judgment is in this circumstance.
>
> Col 1:23 We are holy, blameless and without reproach IN Christ.
>
> And, again -- all of this as if we were hidden in Him.   Solo didache
> is not a hermeneutical rule of any meaningful consequence.   The passage
> you cited must be considered in the light of scripture such as quoted
> above and others, perhaps even more to my point. I will continue the
> search. Such is my answer. jd
>
>
> 1John wrote:
> > In Christ we are not judged.
>
> How do you reconcile this idea with the following passage?
>
> 2 Corinthians 5:10-11
> (10) For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that
> every
> one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath
> done,
> whether it be good or bad.
> (11) Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we
> are
> made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your
> consciences.
>
David Miller

--- Begin Message ---
JD

2 Cor 5:10.11 is written by the same apostle as the scriptures you have posted below and believe me he never ever speaks out of both sides of his mouth ATST - this is our problem - not his because 2 Cor 5:10,11 was written by the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and it stands.

Trying to mix scripture with metaphysics and philosophy is the problem here. This is akin to trying to mix oil with water; it is attempting to conform God's Living Word to some man's dead theology. The letter kills but the Spirit gives life - so we must not forget the ifs, ands, and buts; because all of God's covenants are conditional and there is not a thing wrong with his eyesight. We can not be walking in sin and walking in the "righteousness of Christ" at the same time. The condition for walking free from condemnation is "walking after the spirit and not fulfilling the lust of the flesh" When we choose carnal thinking and fleshly pursuits we make ourselves God's enemy which means we are not free from sin and where there is sin there is also judgment.

As for this (eis) business and the "ontology" some refer to constantly - this has nothing at all to do with God's revelation

and is best left in Greek antiquity with Aristotle and his Metaphysics judyt

On Fri, 17 Mar 2006 06:23:52 +0000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Col 3:3 -- our very lives are hid in Christ. God looks to the righteousness of Christ and it is in this righteousness that we are hidden.

Christ's sacrifice is once and for all time -- emphasis here on "once." It is offered only once because in that offering our sins are fully remitted (Heb 10:18).   There can be no judgment , of the person, if there is no sin.

And II Cor 5: 21 tells us that we have become the righteousness of God IN Christ --   a positional circumstance in this case.

Gal 3:26-27 As many as have been immersed into Christ have put on Christ. We are "in" (eis) the very ontology of Son of God and are becoming like Him in terms of faith and righteousness.  Our personal judgment is in this circumstance.

Col 1:23 We are holy, blameless and without reproach IN Christ.

And, again --  all of this as if we were hidden in Him.   Solo didache is not a hermeneutical rule of any meaningful consequence.   The passage you cited must be considered in the light of scripture such as quoted above and others, perhaps even more to my point. I will continue the search. Such is my answer. jd

1John wrote:
> In Christ we are not judged.

How do you reconcile this idea with the following passage?

2 Corinthians 5:10-11
(10) For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every
one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done,
whether it be good or bad.
(11) Knowing therefore the terror of the Lord, we persuade men; but we are
made manifest unto God; and I trust also are made manifest in your
consciences.

David Miller

--- End Message ---

[TruthTalk] Love and fear

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