Re: [TruthTalk] Hell BoM - confounded LDS

[Dave Hansen]

What does this say about the Power of Mormonism? DAVEH:  I'd respond with......What does this say about the ability of Kevin to understand what he reads?      As I said before, you seem to know a lot about LDS theology, but you seem to have a problem understanding it.  I can only surmise that it is due to your anti-Mormon bias, Kevin.  When you read the LDS material you post, do you ever take the time to try to understand it from the LDS perspective?  It seems not, that you would rather take the words out of context and then use them to support your own way of thinking.  That may impress some who are not aware of the context of what you quote, but for somebody who is well founded in LDS thinking, it only demonstrates your incapacity to understand truth.  Your ability to search, read, copy and paste is not in question, Kevin.  But you frequently seem to lack a fundamental understanding of what you are actually talking about.  DC 71 is a good case that illustrates your lack of understanding.  The section is short, so I will post the entire revelation...... ++++++++++++++++ THE DOCTRINE AND COVENANTS SECTION 71 Revelation given to Joseph Smith the Prophet and Sidney Rigdon, at Hiram, Ohio, December 1, 1831. HC 1: 238—239. The Prophet had continued to translate the Bible with Sidney Rigdon as his scribe until this revelation was received, at which time it was temporarily laid aside so as to enable them to fulfill the instruction given herein. The brethren were to go forth to preach in order to allay the unfriendly feelings that had developed against the Church as a result of the publication of some newspaper articles by Ezra Booth, who had apostatized. 1—4, Joseph Smith and Sidney Rigdon are sent forth to proclaim the gospel; 5—11, Enemies of the saints shall be confounded. 1 BEHOLD, thus saith the Lord unto you my servants Joseph Smith, Jun., and Sidney Rigdon, that the time has verily come that it is necessary and expedient in me that you should open your mouths in proclaiming my gospel, the things of the kingdom, expounding the mysteries thereof out of the scriptures, according to that portion of Spirit and power which shall be given unto you, even as I will. 2 Verily I say unto you, proclaim unto the world in the regions round about, and in the church also, for the space of a season, even until it shall be made known unto you. 3 Verily this is a mission for a season, which I give unto you. 4 Wherefore, labor ye in my vineyard. Call upon the inhabitants of the earth, and bear record, and prepare the way for the commandments and revelations which are to come. 5 Now, behold this is wisdom; whoso readeth, let him understand and receive also; 6 For unto him that receiveth it shall be given more abundantly, even power. 7 Wherefore, confound your enemies; call upon them to meet you both in public and in private; and inasmuch as ye are faithful their shame shall be made manifest. 8 Wherefore, let them bring forth their strong reasons against the Lord. 9 Verily, thus saith the Lord unto you—there is no weapon that is formed against you shall prosper; 10 And if any man lift his voice against you he shall be confounded in mine own due time. 11 Wherefore, keep my commandments; they are true and faithful. Even so. Amen. ++++++++++++++++ .......Now Kevin, assuming you've read the above in its entirety, notice the introduction that explains that this is a Revelation given to Joseph Smith the Prophet and Sidney Rigdon.  Note vs 5, Kevin....... 5 Now, behold this is wisdom; whoso readeth, let him understand and receive also; ..........Apparently you did not understand vs 8 ....... Wherefore, let them bring forth their strong reasons against the Lord ..........which is what happens in SLC during Conference times twice each year.  Nor do you understand........ their shame shall be made manifest. .........may refer to those who like the SPers who stand out along the street waving underwear.  Vs 9...... there is no weapon that is formed against you shall prosper; ..........I suspect the SPers waving the underwear profiteth little from their exercise in futility. if any man lift his voice against you he shall be confounded in mine own due time. .........Do you understand what he shall be confounded in mine own due time means, Kevin?  I would think you do, since when you quoted it..... And if any man lift his voice against you he shall be confounded ........you conveniently left a pertinent part of that passage....in mine own due time.......off.  Very telling, IMO. Kevin Deegan wrote: But Jesus did not have a command as in DC 71 COMMANDING him to confound. Why all the verses on confounding when to all observers it would seem that it is in reality the LDS who are confounded? Seems the LDS god has called and none have answered. Men women or children. On paper in 1Nep 17 LDS are preach but in Reality, The SP's preach and none can contend against them What does this say about the Power of Mormonism?   And as answwer to the dry ink of Helaman, The SP's preach with great power and LDS come forthe outside the gates of the temple confess their sins and become Christians! What does this say about the Power of Mormonism? =============== Where are the valiant ones like in Helaman? LDS don't have even one that believes thier gods words in DC 71?   No one believes the promise of DC 71? there is no weapon that is formed against you shall prosper;   And if any man lift his voice against you he shall be confounded   I lift my voice on a regular basis right outside your solemn assemblies and NONE can answer. What does this say about the Power of Mormonism? These verses are not worth the paper they are printed on. ================ Dave <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: The tables have been turned! The SP's call the LDS shudder! DAVEH:  Perhaps you are right, Kevin.  I know I don't have much fight in me at the moment.  Perhaps the modern LDS people just aren't conditioned to be contentious, which would explain why some would rather avoid the SPers rather than confront them.      I would liken it to when Jesus was in court and faced with a lot of false accusations.  Given the chance to rebut the charges, he simply remained quiet.  Likewise, perhaps Mormons would rather just let blithering idiots blither rather than jump into the mud with them.  I know I feel that way sometimes. Kevin Deegan wrote: You are not doing what the early church did   DM brings up a great point. Since the LDS are a RESTORATION of the Early Church, why are you are not doing what the early church did?   I checked the word CONFOUND and it seems to be the Spirit of God come upon the characters in the BoM etc. Yet it is evidenced today by a complete reversal being that the LDS are confounded and speak not a word in Salt Lake City! And all this while the LDS are Commanded to confound us PUBLICLY! DC 71 Wherefore, confound your enemies; call upon them to meet you both in public and in private; and inasmuch as ye are faithful their shame shall be made manifest. Wherefore, let them bring forth their strong reasons against the Lord.  Veri ly, thus saith the Lord unto you—there is no weapon that is formed against you shall prosper;   And if any man lift his voice against you he shall be confounded   The tables have been turned! The SP's call the LDS shudder!   ARE THESE TRUE? 1 Ne 17 And it came to pass that I, Nephi, said many things unto my brethren, insomuch that they were confounded and could not contend against me   Jacob 1 The words of his preaching unto his brethren. He confoundeth a man who seeketh to overthrow the doctrine of Christ   Jacob 7:8 But behold, the Lord God poured in his Spirit into my soul, insomuch that I did confound him in all his words. Mosiah 12 19 And they began to question him, that they might cross him, that thereby they might have wherewith to accuse him; but he answered them boldly, and withstood all their questions, yea, to their astonishment; for he did withstand them in all their questions, and did confound them in all their words.   Where are the GREAT LDS Preachers? Hel. 5:17  And it came to pass that they did preach with great power, insomuch that they did confound many of those dissenters who had gone over from the Nephites, insomuch that they came forth and did confess their sins and were baptized unto repentance, and immediately returned to the Nephites to endeavor to repair unto them the wrongs which they had done. Since the LDS god could not find any Men you would think he could at least find some Women or Children? Does this mean Missionary BOYS? Where are they?  ; ) Alma 32:23 And now, he imparteth his word by angels unto men, yea, not only men but women also. Now this is not all; little children do have words given unto them many times, which confound the wise and the learned.   BTW wasn't the LDS god also CONFOUNDED when he lost 116 pages of the original BoM? David Miller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: David Miller wrote: >> Do you ever warn people about >> the FIRE of hell? DAVEH wrote: > No, I don't do much preaching, and when > I do....I prefer to be more positive in my > approach. I guess the LDS organization has not restored the church then, eh? You are not doing what the early church did. :-) David Miller -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS. Yahoo! Travel Find great deals to the top 10 hottest destinations! -- ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Dave Hansen [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.langlitz.com ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ If you wish to receive things I find interesting, I maintain six email lists... JOKESTER, OPINIONS, LDS, STUFF, MOTORCYCLE and CLIPS.