> So, while not precisely true,
> > the statement is still in general a valid point.
> 
> It isn't. It's both true and false in equal measure about both 
> TurboGears and Django (Rails has none of these meta-features, so I'm not 
> certain what you lose by using one of the alternate ORMS or template 
> engines with that framework).

Well, we disagree here. You are basing your view on a parallel between
TG and Django that I think is stretched too far:

Catwalk != Django Admin
Appeal of TG != Appeal of Django

Catwalk is a lightweight tool for developers, and is *not* one of the
core selling points of TG. The Django Admin is for users and is, IMHO,
*the* core selling point for Django. The strengths of Django are very
well done integration and docs, and the admin. I have used it for two
client projects where the admin was good enough. TG's strengths are
elsewhere, newer components ( SQLAlchemy is usable now, not "coming
soon" ), looser component coupling, and far better DOM scripting tools
( widgets, mochkit integration, formencode, etc. Without the Django
admin, I have no real liking for it, the only other strong point is the
url dispatching. For me, the ORM, form handling, and templating are all
icky compared to TGs. And if I'm going to write my own much more
customized admin, I'd way rather use the tg widgets for the job then
hack on the django admin.

So, if you know that an admin interface that is highly reflective of
your db structure is good enough for the job, Django is very attractive.
If you already know that you won't be using the Django admin, than it
loses its attraction. That's my point, not a component by component
comparison.

It's like saying you lose the same amount from a ferrari and a honda if
you swap out the engine. Not the same at all, you buy a ferrari for the
performance, you buy a honda for reliability ... The fact that they both
have engines that move the car does not mean that the purchaser is as
attracted to the engine in each situation.

Of course this is indeed subjective, so I can understand disagreeing.
Iain



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