On 12/20/10 4:19 PM, Colin Alston wrote: > On Mon, Dec 20, 2010 at 5:01 PM, Werner Thie <[email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: > > Hi Colin > > off list just for my information, what version of nevow/athena do > have you have included in enamel. The latest fixes I sent back to > the divmod list solved bugs server and client side when detaching > Live Elements from a page, which I do habitually very often. > > > Enamel works on pretty much any version, but doesn't work with > contextless Page and other stuff. > > The motivator for it's creation was to increase dev speed with people > who were slightly useless, and to act as a wrapper to make code trees > that could survive Freeze. > > > What do you see as important areas where nevow/athena should be > improved? > > > Primarily there is a great deal of bootstrapping. Just create a simple > web-app (without something like Methanal or Mantissa, which I can't even > understand) that does Athena and see how much code you're rewriting > every time, it's quite insane. My boilerplate (me working with guys mostly doing PHP and MySQL) let's me start up a new project in less than an hour. Doing this for a living I see the problem not really in starting up projects fast, but in finishing them fast, because only finished projects are paying...
> Also if you're not using Twisted plugins (which there are many reasons > not to want to, like using shared state reactors with multiple TCP > services, or again Freeze) the pain goes up double. I use only a single plugin in nevow letting me bootstrap easily and providing a clean mechanism to switch automagically between source/compressed deployment version. All the deployment is handled via SVN. > Essentially boiling Athena down to a page mixin class with standard js > bootstraps, and/or separate fragment mixin and making all pages derive > the necessary Athena object triggers or even putting that into flatten. Might be that there's need for a 'kiddy' version, letting the average interested user who does not have the time to look into a framework and its concepts and wants to whip up a page in less than 30 seconds. > You can see what I do here to try simplify things for the way I work, > essentially I just stick an elements class dict in and map fragments to > automatically created renderers and stuff works magically. > http://open.thusa.net/enamel/browser/trunk/enamel/pages.py#L126 I see the basic idea, no objection, but why Fragments and not Elements? > There's also issues with the current model, like your root resource > can't be an Athena page very easily. I don't understand this point, I usually work root only, with not a standard page change, but doing everything by attaching/detaching live elements (see http;//www.thieprojects.ch for work in progress for a simple Desktop like RIA) Werner _______________________________________________ Twisted-web mailing list [email protected] http://twistedmatrix.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/twisted-web
