On Mon, May 24, 2010 at 5:08 AM, Conrad Knauer <[email protected]> wrote: > I like the repository system that Ubuntu uses, but I feel that there > is a problem with it and I have a suggestion as to how to fix it. > > ~ The Problem ~ > > Ubuntu inherited the Debian system of updating software versions with > OS upgrades. This makes the most sense when you have many many > packages that are slow in updating (e.g. due to code maturity) and/or > you are upgrading your OS relatively frequently. An example of where > this is a bad idea is Firefox, especially on LTS releases; an excerpt > from http://packages.ubuntu.com/search?keywords=firefox showing the > releases still supported on the Desktop: > > Package firefox > > * hardy (web): meta package for the popular mozilla web browser > 3.0.19+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.8.04.1 [security]: all > * jaunty (web): meta package for the popular mozilla web browser > 3.0.19+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.9.04.1 [security]: all > * karmic (web): meta package for the popular mozilla web browser > 3.5.9+nobinonly-0ubuntu0.9.10.1 [security]: all > * lucid (web): safe and easy web browser from Mozilla > 3.6.3+nobinonly-0ubuntu4: amd64 i386 > > Most Firefox users have already moved to version 3.6 (see the graph on > http://gs.statcounter.com/#browser_version-ww-monthly-200904-201005) > which is where Mozilla wants you to be also BTW. Getting a new > version of Firefox on an old version of Ubuntu can be a pain. > Supporting Firefox 3.0.x which is no longer supported by Mozilla (see > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mozilla_Firefox_3) seems silly. PPAs are > unofficial. Mozilla doesn't have a DEB repo and even if they do make > one, they might not offer packages other than for x86-32. > > ~ A Solution ~ > > Now, assuming that there are no technical reasons why Firefox 3.6 > can't be built for all the currently supported versions of Ubuntu, we > can do the following for future releases; get rid of the "main" repo > as it currently stands and replace it with two repositories: > > (1) a 'core' which will represent everything up to and including Gnome > (for Ubuntu; KDE for Kubuntu, etc.), so to a working GUI including > some basic apps (like Totem). This is stuff that most users assume > will just work and don't want to fiddle with or upgrade for a while > once they're working right. If Ubuntu is a 'software libre > supermarket', these are the canned, dried and frozen goods that have a > moderate to long shelf life. This repo should retain the 'main' > designation. > > (2) the 'desktop' applications currently in main that people really > would like to stay current. Especially Firefox, but also OpenOffice, > GIMP, etc. (that is, the 'big' ones (usually recommended by the > ubuntu-desktop metapackage, or otherwise in main) that aren't part of > Gnome proper...). In the supermarket analogy, these are the big showy > fresh fruit displayed at room temperature. > > Perhaps a line in the sources.list could look like this: > > deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop maverick main > > In 'main' cases like Firefox where you can have two versions that are > officially supported for a time, have a metapackage (e.g. firefox) > pointing at the newest release, but the actual versions in the names > of packages that contain data (e.g. firefox-3.5 and firefox-3.6). > This will allow users to pick if they would rather transition > automatically to the latest version or maintain the old version *while > it is still supported* (e.g. for businesses which tend to be slower in > adopting new versions... also, for people like my wife who bitterly > complain that new releases always break things... e.g. Firefox > extensions) since desktop software seems to have unpredictable release > cycles very much not in synch with Ubuntu's. > > In the case of Firefox (let's say starting in 2009 after Firefox 2 > reached an end of life), my solution would work like this: > > - start 2009 > > firefox metapackage points to firefox-3.0 > > - June 30, 2009: Firefox 3.5 released > > firefox metapackage changed shortly to point to firefox-3.5 > repository contains both firefox-3.0 and firefox-3.5 > > - January 21, 2010: Firefox 3.6 released > > firefox metapackage changed shortly to point to firefox-3.6 > repository contains firefox-3.0, firefox-3.5 and firefox-3.6 > > - March 30, 2010: final version of 3.0 (3.0.19) released > > firefox-3.0 to be removed in a timely manner (a week or two?) > > - August 2010: final version of 3.5 to be released > > firefox-3.5 to be removed in a timely manner (a week or two?) > > - late 2010: Firefox 4.0 (hopefully ;) releases > > firefox metapackage changed shortly to point to firefox-4.0 > repository contains firefox-3.6 and firefox-4.0 > > etc. > > ~ Misc. Thoughts ~ > > Splitting out the desktop apps would mean that old LTS releases (like > Dapper, which is expired for the desktop but still supported for the > server) would not need to keep ancient browser packages around (like > Firefox 1.5)! > > There are some notable 'desktop' apps in Universe (e.g. VLC, Chromium > (chromium-browser), Thunderbird and Wine spring to mind), which are > under active development and could be treated similarly... Perhaps > "deb http://archive.ubuntu.com/ubuntu-desktop maverick universe" ? > > Sincerely, > Conrad Knauer
This idea has been raised before in various forms. See http://www.mail-archive.com/[email protected]/msg02743.html I suggest you read through to the end of the thread, since a lot of good points are raised on both sides. I'm not against the idea, but there are still some obstacles to overcome. Cheers, Evan -- Ubuntu-devel-discuss mailing list [email protected] Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel-discuss
