On Friday, June 14, 2013 11:15:17 AM Marc Deslauriers wrote: > On 13-06-14 11:04 AM, Scott Kitterman wrote: > > On Friday, June 14, 2013 03:54:32 PM Jonathan Riddell wrote: > >> Here's a discussion I half started as part of vUDS. > >> > >> The switch to Mir in Ubuntu seems pretty risky for the existance of > >> Kubuntu, I wonder if other flavours have the same probable problem. > >> > >> KWin dev has opinions on the subject > >> http://blog.martin-graesslin.com/blog/2013/05/mir-in-kubuntu/ From the > >> > >> architecture section on that blog post: > >> "Mir’s architecture is centered around Unity. It is difficult to really > >> understand the architecture of Mir as the specification is so full of > >> buzz-words that I don’t understand it [5]. From all I can see and > >> understand Unity Next is a combination of window manager and desktop > >> shell implemented on top of Mir. How exactly this is going to look > >> like I do not know. Anyway it does not fit our design of having > >> desktop shell and window manager separated and we do not know whether > >> Mir would support that. We also do not know whether Mir would allow > >> any other desktop shell except Unity Next, given that this is the main > >> target. Wayland on the other hand is designed to have more than one > >> compositor implementations. Using KWin as a session compositor is an > >> example in the spec." > >> > >> and on protocol > >> > >> "But it gets worse, the protocol between Mir server and Mir clients > >> is defined as not being stable. In fact it’s promised that it will > >> break. That’s a huge problem, I would even call it a showstopper.... > >> Given that the protocol may change any time and given that the whole > >> thing is developed for the needs of Unity we have to expect that the > >> server libraries are not binary compatible or that old version of the > >> server libraries cannot talk with the latest client libraries" > >> > >> Canonical was going to port LightDM to Wayland but now does not plan > >> to so someone else would have to do this. KDE might be interested > >> but more likely will switch to SDDM. > >> > >> For Kubuntu the options are: > >> - Use Mir - infeasable as upstream can't support it as described above > >> - Use Wayland with packages from Debian and hope we can make those > >> packages > >> > >> live with Mir as best as possible > >> > >> - End of Kubuntu > >> > >> The second options is the one I'm expecting. It's completely unknown > >> how much it means Kubuntu and other flavours will need to maintain X > >> and Wayland packages, hopefully not much (it's hardly our speciality) > >> and hopefully Debian and Ubuntu Desktop will support it enough. > >> > >> I don't think there's a public timeline for Mir so we don't know when > >> this will hit us, presumably in the next year. > >> > >> Other flavours I think are this: > >> Mythbuntu: not evaluated, hope to do so once NVideo and AMD provide > >> drivers > >> Lubuntu: not evaluated, hope to use X and GTK > >> ubuntustudio: I've heard both that they use xfce based on xubuntu and > >> will follow them, and "aiming for users to choose whatever desktop > >> environment they want" > >> > >> Any other flavours got an opinions? > >> > >> Are there any misconceptions I have in the above? > > > > Given that mesa is going to be heavily patched to support Mir, I question > > the long term feasibility of supporting Wayland in Ubuntu. > > How would adding a new backend to mesa result in it being "heavily > patched"? Why would adding a new backend to mesa affect the other > backends, including Wayland?
Upstream kwin tells us they already see bug reports from Kubuntu users due to mesa changes to support Unity. I don't think it's just a new back end. Scott K -- ubuntu-devel mailing list ubuntu-devel@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-devel
