Alex,

Thanks once again for your thoughts.

As a small preface for what I am about to ask, I wish to say, the aspect of modern computing that really truly interests me, is the open architecture dimensions. It is, in short, to me, much like the inclusive democratic process, very necessary to constantly struggle, variously, appropriately as possible, to maintain in actual functionality & possible realization. 

I have been mulling over some of the proposed paths you suggest... My one outstanding thought is simply this (& it may be simplistic, but it is a real question for me, now):

With all due respect to the Ubuntu Studio team, who clearly have put in an a heroic effort in to building it, from what I understand you to say, seems like a good argument to not use Ubuntu Studio at all... as it seems rather like a monster which one cannot extract important parts themselves from except perhaps at the risk of totally falling apart. Why not just install the regular Ubuntu, & build from there...? I just downloaded the CD install image, & it was less than 700 mb (though I do realize it gets expanded once installed & updated.

Regards,
Henry

p.s., I have become reasonably functional in Windows XP. My sound card works... I can, with a minimal effort (though not in a too terribly sophisticated manner) do midi & audio production , & I use for notation composition Finale 2008 (I have been using a version of this program since about 1995).

alex stone wrote:
Henry, if you're in the mood to experiment, then i respectfully suggest you do a clean install of Hardy, rather than a overbuild. I've tried that, and got burnt.
The Ubuntu desktop is a decent bit of craftsmanship, but if you're building a dedicated Audio box, then you have choices. Before you step in, have a think about using a lightweight desktop. What will happen here is you'll get a more sprightly working environment. When you install deb packages, and some GTK, or KDE dependencies are required, they'll generally get picked up in the repos, as part of a package install process.
 
Some other observations i made:
 
When i install up to date packages like Ingen, Patchage, etc, they tell me in the configure stage if my installed dependency packages are 'modern' enough. I found that is was easier, if a bit longer, to downloaded some required libs from source. (and that was the case with the example i gave of libsoundfile 1.0.18. Debian has this now as a deb package, but at the time, i installed it from source.) This process takes a while if you're new at linux like me, so patience is the order of the day.
The same is true of great apps like linuxsampler, rosegarden, etc. Up to date versions from source have many new features, and with all of these, you can, from online repos, through SVN, CVS, GIT, and Waf, up date your source, then simply compile and reinstall. It doesn't take long to get into the rhythm of this, and i have found once a week works for me. Every Sunday evening, i go through my list, and update the apps, and recompile in a test partition. If they build without problems, then they get the same treatment in the 'real' partition. It seems clumsy, but it works, and doesn't leave with a broken app. (Not including the wonderful animal that is User Error.)
 
You mentioned the RT kernel.
In UbStudio, and other media oriented distros, there is (generally) an RT build for your kernel, waiting to be installed. That makes it easy for us to change a domestic use build to something a little more enthusastic, and of a lower latency, by nature of the RT kernel intent. In Ubuntu Hardy, there's an RT kernel ready to be installed, but in UBstudio, the RT kernel is already installed as part of the UBstudio framework.
 
Jack.
When i first started with Jack, it was an exercise in confusion. It took me a little while to figure it out, but when i did, it was easy to maintain, install, use, and tweak. To put it simply, ALSA sits in the kernel, and Jack is a layer above that. Jack will use the device you choose, be it Alsa, Freebob, OSS, or FFADO, and it creates a server framework with which you can cable multiple apps together in a 'live' environment. With an RT kernel, you can tweak Jack effectively to lower latency to that sweet spot that is a balance between extremely low latency and potential instability, usually referred to as Xruns, and a generous enough allowance in latency that gives you a reasonably live playing feedback and stability. Mileage with this varies from user to user according to hardware, and it's a case of tweak and try, tweak and try, until you find that spot that suits your working environment, and the type of music you want to write. (Some will want really low latency for live use, i.e. Sing along through a mike, or play an instrument, and others may be happy with a slightly higher latency as they do everything 'in the box.')
 
Since i started using Jack, i'm still amazed at how versatile and powerful it is. The only limits are your hardware.
 
And that means, given the professional server that is Jack, versus the domestic server that is Pulse, you decide which direction you want to take. Jack and Pulse will play together, with a bit of work, but STRICTLY imho, it's not a happy marriage, and i opted for sacrificing the UBDesktop, in favour of an audio/recording box that works, and does what it says on the tin, with up to date apps. I've just installed Debian 5 on my ppc laptop for use on the road. I discover the LXDE, or lightweight X11 desktop environment, and it's been impressive so far. I may well consider this for the work box, as an alternative to a full Gnome, KDE, or Gnome based UBstudio desktop scheme.
 
/ as the partition mount point is correct. It's the 'base' or root directory, above which the directory tree is built.  
It's after this, when you get to the choice of package installs, that you can select which components you want to have in the initial installation process. I'm still not smart enough with linux to do a barebones kernel install to a terminal, then download and install a fast, small desktop, and all the components for a lean build totally dedicated to a working environment, but i'm working on it. More study still needed on my part.........
 
There is no RT kernel for Intrepid. (8.10) There were so many significant changes to the vanilla kernel at the time, that it would have involved a hefty chunk of time, and effort, on the part of the UBstudio team to build. We had a discussion about this not so long ago, and Cory from the UB team gave us plenty of notice that there would be a delay, or possibly, a version skip, to Jaunty. (9.0.4) So Hardy is your 'current' RT kernel. There are reports which have been posted here, of intrepid users regressing to the hardy RT kernel without problems, but it's strictly a personal choice of risk. Personally, i've stuck with my barebone Hardy UBStudio, and source built the significant apps, with some source libs installs as while.
 
Documentation.
 
There's a few gaps here and there, agreed, but there also a fair body of reference available too. For regular apps, like Jack, Alsa, Ardour, Linuxsampler, you'll find enough to get you going, and find your way around the apps fairly comfortably. For Rosegarden there's a good manual (I can vouch for this one as i've worn the cover off more than one copy.), and the Musescore manual is growing fast. It's a case of googling, and reading.
 
Pre-install.
 
You won't have a choice to install Pulse or not. That's 'builtin.' (No further comment needed here.) You either keep it, in an UBStudio environment, or dump it, and lose the dependencies. To be fair and objective, there is a matching pair of sink and source modules that will enable you to run Jack through Pulse, but i never got this to work properly, and just ended up using an .asoundrc file telling Alsa to route everything into Jack. This worked for me, so if it aint broke........
The jack modules for pulse allegedly enable you to have an automated process, which suspends pulse when you start jack, and automatically resumes pulse when jack is stopped. It may be better now, or the process may enable you to use both simultaneously, but i guess i've grown old fashioned and got bored with trying to make it work, as the simplicity of using Jack, and an .asoundrc file seemed a lot less complicated, and easier to setup and use. Mine is a working box without all the domestic stuff, so pulse was redundant anyway. Again, you have a choice.
 
I have a question for you here.
 
Which apps are you using the most? Maybe, even with my modest experience, i can give you more specific information.
 
Finally, i was running a triple boot setup for a fairly brief period of time, Win XP, Linux 32bit, and linux 64bit. I got rid of the win as soon as i could, and have an all native linux box now. (Yahoo)
I have a couple more updated apps to test when i get home, but i'll plump for a single boot source based 64bit parchment studios unique build for the next and final challenge. (I don't use VST's any more.) It can be time consuming to keep up with more than 1 workbased boot, imho, and i have the laptop for admin. As is the case for linux in general, we are spoilt for choice. (and then some.)
 
Alex.
 



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