On 18/08/2003 13:36, Mark Davis wrote:

I'm sorry that you haven't gotten responses before. I have searched through my
email archive, and can't find anything like the message, and I don't think it
was brought up to the UTC formally.

The first one seems odd, and as you say, it would seem to only affect a
vanishingly small number of characters; since these are final character, one
presumes there would be subsequent characters that would form a larger
difference anyway.

Mark
__________________________________
http://www.macchiato.com
►  “Eppur si muove” ◄

----- Original Message ----- From: "Matitiahu Allouche" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Mark Davis" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>; <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, August 18, 2003 10:08
Subject: [bidi] Re: Unicode Collation Algorithm: 4.0 Update (beta)





I have submitted the following text on the Unicode Reporting form.

This report relates to the collation tables for Hebrew as displayed in
http://www.unicode.org/charts/collation/beta/chart_Hebrew.html

I have already formulated the following remarks in the past, but no action
has been taken, so I repeat them here.

1) Precedence of Dagesh over Final/non-Final: in the chart, the presence
or absence of Dagesh is a Secundary difference, while Final/non-Final is a
Tertiary difference.  This is relevant only for letters Kaf and Pe.  My
gut feeling says that Final/non-Final should have precedence over
Dagesh/no-Dagesh.
Note that the number of actual cases where this would make a difference is
probably *very* small.

2) There is something strange in the combinations of Shin with Dagesh and
dots: for all other letters, the form without Dagesh sorts before the form
with Dagesh.  But Shin with Sin/Shin dot sort after their corresponding
combinations with Dagesh.  I cannot imagine a justification for that.

I have submitted those reservations to the Technical Committee 2109 of the
SII (Standards Institution of Israel, the Israeli NB), which deals with
Hebrew-related standards in IT, and the committee endorsed my point of
view.  I can ask the committee to send you a confirmation letter if
required.

I would like to see some action taken on my remarks this time, or at least
some justified refutation.


Shalom (Regards), Mati Bidi Architect Globalization Center Of Competency - Bidirectional Scripts IBM Israel Phone: +972 2 5888802 Fax: +972 2 5870333 Mobile: +972 52 554160


Sent by: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> cc: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Subject: [bidi] Re: Unicode Collation Algorithm: 4.0 Update (beta)


There are also beta collation charts in:


http://www.unicode.org/charts/collation/beta/

Mark




Mati, I am interested to see that you and SII have been giving attention to collation in Hebrew. I have also been doing so, on the recently set up Unicode Hebrew list ([EMAIL PROTECTED]), as I was also concerned about ordering of shin dots, dagesh etc. I have not yet had any reply to my posting on this subject which I made two days ago. I will forward my posting to you in case you have not seen it.


-- Peter Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] (personal) [EMAIL PROTECTED] (work) http://www.qaya.org/





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