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Awesome. More stuff to come to terms with.
Thanks Folks
Neil Cooke
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005 9:19
PM
Subject: Re: Spline Modelling
question
Hey Neil,
the first one was for this model
Somewhere in there is a short threat for using Zbrush with RS. The
animation simply showed the result of that.
The second one is a nice talking face anim with morphs, which cannot be
captured with stills..
Daniel
PS: Broadband is only as fast as the corresponding
server..
On 10/12/05, Neil
Cooke <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:
And I thought Broadband was going to solve
everything. Can't open either of those .avi's. Any screen shots some
place?
Neil Cooke
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Wednesday, October 12, 2005
7:27 PM
Subject: Re: Spline Modelling
question
Some impressive ones (made with bump-maps):
and this:
Have a look at the very, very detailed geometry
;-)
Matthias
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2005
8:15 PM
Subject: Re: Spline Modelling
question
Thanks Endre, and yes, I've just run into
the "keep it simple and use bumps" thing in another project ... SDS
detail down to nuts, bolts and washers ... only to apply a rust/eroded
material and see that analytic cylinders would have worked faster and
with no image loss.
Neil Cooke
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, October 11, 2005
4:00 PM
Subject: AW: Spline Modelling
question
Hi
Neil,
my vote is SDS too,
and as i know, all human faces modeller are using
SDS.
Some tips:
1. keep it simple
(some details can be done with displacement mapping
later)
2. if you want to
animate it, keep in mind the deformations parts behaviour (at these
places you need more control points, to achieve that it behave as you
want ;- )
Regards
Endre
Thanks Stefan and Boris,
Your vote is mainly SDS for human face
modelling.
The trouble with human faces is that I
don't use them in my personal work, only for client work, which
means I need the most efficient drawing systems . . . so if there
had been a more useful approach I wanted to know.
SDS is fun for me and so I'm glad to
hear that it's the weapon of choice for you folk
too.
Neil Cooke.
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, October 10,
2005 1:15 AM
Subject: Re: Spline Modelling
question
Hi Neil n all..
I personally now adays mostly just
work in SDS, after "Getting it" some years ago, I feel SDS
is really awesome...
When I "got it" some years ago, I
felt as one with the SDS tools, (in the way that I felt from one
point and on, how I would do in SDS to get the result I
wanted...)
I sometimes though, use on some parts
of my models, the Nurbs to SDS workflow.., since some shapes are
really much easier to "Draw" with a curve than moving
points/edges/faces around...
But I never use it in big parts of a
model..
I also at times 'Lattice Map' points
of a SDS model to Curves or Nurbs Meshes, and then I modify them..
this is a sort of a workaround, to get easier control over
handling more points/edges/faces in one go...
(This is pretty good, since if you
dont like your changes, just set the 'Weight' to 0, of the chor
that is attatched to the SDS object)
I try to use all the types of objects
and methods... the most important thing is to get the best feel
for YOU and what gives the best results in the end of the day...!
(its very personal what types and what workflows that each of us
"feels" best...and give best results)
I use Analytics, Nurbs and SDS where
I see it fit, and different workflows for different situations
within each prj I fiddle with...!
So in the end, its very hard to say
what is best, since its very personal, and for some it can be a
problem if they since a long time been working in one way, to
later start using new methods...
For it to be a good transition, one
really need a aha moment..then it usually seems obvious to change
workflow to the newer and better way of doing
things...
For all that havent yet got that
"aha" "Wow" feeling when SDS modelling, I really hope they get to
experience it.. its an awesome feeling..!
This is a good topic to discuss
around, since we all have so many ways of doing things, and
sharing, will at least gives us all, new ideas of how things Can
be done..
Some of it we can snap up and use,
other things wont suit me, but other will find very
useful...
I would really want to see more
Videos..where RS users share some of their
workflows...
Since seeing ppl in action really can
let you "get it" !!! (which is very hard to see in text and still
images only...)
Take Care
Best Regards
Stefan Gustafsson ( Beg-inner
)
A Proud Owner and User of Real3D and
Realsoft3D..
Hi Stefan,
Thanks for your info on this so
far.
Off the topic but if you are
modelling a human face is the Nurbs to SDS method the one you
would use? The manual suggests many systems but usually in the
text states that "this is ot the best way" ... what's the best
way is the question.
I have had only one human faced
commissioned and used SDS but the job only went to rough ideas
so it was done in a hurry.
Neil Cooke
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Sunday, October 09,
2005 10:11 PM
Subject: Re: Spline
Modelling question
Hi Daniel n all...
Yep you are correct in that you
cant delete points (well you can in the curves, but when
converting to SDS, the SDS has an evenly spread Number of
points...so delete points dont affect the SDS..)
So yes.. if you do too
complicated Nurbs, then this will be a factor that isnt
good....
But if you just use it for the
basic, since its easy to get smooth organic feel when using
the Curves.. and as RS SDS implementation is using Nurbs in
full.. your SDS gets that smooth shape.. even when using only
3 points in the curves..
So for creating the ground for
some more organic parts of a model, using the Nurb Tools, can
really be helpful...
Using Nurbs to premodel the shape
of the area around the mouth, can be a good way to
use it.. to get a nice flow around the Mouth area, to get the
Edgeloops right and nice flowing, like the muscles in that
area.. and using low number of points in the curves you still
gets to see the shape of it, and it will also keep that smooth
shape when converting to SDS..!!! (So you get a Get What You
See type of modeling..)
And since you also can do as many
of these Nurbs Parts as you want/need... that you later can
convert into SDS models, and then Merge these into one Single
SDS object if you like,
you can have Control over Mesh
density, and have higher resolution on areas where you want
it..
This single SDS, can you then
continue to build on...connecting the parts in any way you
choose..
This workflow differs from those
older Nurbs Tuts, and shouldnt be used to build a complete
model..
SDS modelilng really rock,
but can be complemented and made easier in some parts if using
Nurbs where is useful...
Maybe the SDS Tools should in
future versions of RS, include some of the best parts of the
Nurbs Modelling part integrated...
Yep those rocked that could do
amazing stuff back then..
I then instead used a feature in
RS, the ShrinkWrap one... where I placed Analytic
Spheres and so on and then Had a Mesh Sphere or such,
that I ShrinkWrapped around the Analytics.. it worked
pretty well.. =)... (alot more intuitive workflow, at least
for me.., than fiddle with build it up completly curve by
curve.. =)
Take Care
Best Regards
Stefan Gustafsson (
Beg-inner )
A Proud Owner and User of Real3D and
Realsoft3D..
Hey Stefan n all,
that is some good advice, I'll definitely give that a
try for my next model.
What I still think, though, is that in order
to use splines in RS you have to be quite
organized about what you're building.. there is
no deleting points and reconnecting them elsewhere..
sure, I can insert a new curve, but that thing is going
to cruise through the whole model and create more density
and detail where I don't need it, making the whole thing
harder and harder to handle.
I never understood those guys who could model heads and
stuff in Real3d. I could build a vase back then, that was it
:)
Daniel
On 10/8/05, Beg-inner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Daniel n
all..
You could do as I do some
times..
1. Use a nurbs curve to draw
the organic outline of what you need, for example an
ear....
2. Now in the 'Controlbar'
click the 'Parallel' Curve Tool, In 'View' Win click
near the curve, to Create the second curve
3. Multiselect Select both of
the curves and click 'X-Sect' Tool, now you have
a NurbsMesh Level, with those curves inside
it
4. Point edit and/or just
move the curves in depth...
5. Do Step 2 again, to
create more curves to shape the basic shape of the
ear...
(the curves are placed in
NurbsMesh Level, If needed you have to move some
of them above other curves)
When pleased with the basic
shape of it, make a Copy of the NurbsMesh Level and delete
its Curves
(You only need a copy if you
like to have the original to go back and edit the curves
and so on...)
Now in the 'SDS' Tab of the
'Tabbed' Toolsbar, click 'To SDS' Tool... to convert your
Nurbsmesh to a SDS object..
Do the same for other parts
of a face, for instance the mouth area....
After you have your wanted
areas of your (in this case head model), then Multiselect
the SDS versions of them, and in the 'Controlbar' use the
'Merge Object' Tool
(Now you have it as a whole
model, and you can Merge Points, or Add faces between an
Edge of for instance the Mouth area to an edge of of the
Ear area... and so on..)
This was just a fast
example...
I also at times, use Nurbs to
do Tentacles, horns and such.., convert them into SDS,
merge them to main SDS object...
You can find more tips on
converting Nurbs into SDS.. in the manual in 'SDS
Modelling' part.. in the 'Converting Objects to
Subdivision form'
If something or all is
unclear... just ask..!
(Hope I havent made any
errors..=)
Take Care
Best Regards
Stefan Gustafsson (
Beg-inner )
A Proud Owner and User of Real3D and
Realsoft3D..
Thanks, guys, for clearing up that confusion so
quickly.
Now Boxmodelling I know and love, but this other
approach seems to be so much smoother for organics,
that's why I ask.. AND I have never managed to build
anything out of nurbs in Realsoft unless it is a curtain
or a flag.
Maybe that's just me, but I've only started
modelling since SDS came on board.
Again, thanks for the help and have a nice weekend
everybody.
Daniel
On 10/7/05, Aidan O Driscoll <[EMAIL PROTECTED] > wrote:
Hi
Daniel,
as I thought . after posting. Yes a
nice feature for RS V6 me thinks.
Building a
surface with splines like so and / or a single poly
drawn and
another can be added to it
etc.
An alternayive is the Box Modelling method
for a head like this:
http://www.secondreality.ch/tutorials/modelling/head/headhtml
Also look at the rest here:
http://www.secondreality.ch/tutorials/tutorials.html
Lots
of other tutes like this online re Box Modelling,
Cheers
Aidan.
At 17:47 07/10/2005,
you wrote:
>Hi Daniel,
>
>
>
>
Hey
everybody,
>
just a quick question about something that's starting
to confuse me,
>
lately I've been running into a lot of tutorial about
spline
>modelling, such as this one
>
http://demented3d.com/tutorial/toontutorial/modeling/headhtml
for
>example,
>
and I wonder how to do that in realsoft... is that
even
possible?
>
I mean, the techniques applied look same as cage
modelling, but
with
>splines...?
>
Maybe I'm missing something :/
>
>
Thanks for any insight on
this.
>
Daniel
>
>
>I think what happens in
this tutorial is that the areas between the
splines
>are filled with polygons.
>This
is not (yet?) the case in Realsoft3D. Splines in
Realsoft3D need to be
>skinned; a totally
different approach.
>
>Best
regards,
>Robert
>
>
>
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