IMHO, I can sum up the ease of .NET development with one sentence.
ALL MS. It's much easier to make things easier when you have only ONE target environment. So,
the tools, the languages, the IDE's,the OS are all very tightly coupled. Can I put .NET on a REAL enterprise OS, like Solaris, AIX
or Linux. NOPE.
Frank Zammetti wrote:
As someone who is 98% a J2EE developer but has done two reasonably complex .Net web projects... Forget comparing the two for a moment and just look at .Net by itself... There's not too much bad to say about it on it's own. Microsoft has frankly put out something that is technically a fine piece of work. SO FAR it has proven to be relatively stable and even secure, no worse than Java was at first anyway, and better in some ways.
As far as ease of use, I personally haven't used Visual Studio.Net much, I prefer being "closer to the metal", so to speak (in this case, that means doing mostly command line work and using UltraEdit, just as I do my Java development). I think you do get the "trained monkey symdrome" to a degree when VS.Net is in the mix, but that's not automatically true.
Design patterns can and are realized in .Net just like in J2EE.
In short... If J2EE didn't exist, .Net would be an excellent solution. Yes, there is obviously vendor lock-in, and yes you have to be worried about security and what might be found down the road (so far so good though). Performance is excellent, stability is excellent, and so on.
Now, in terms of comparisons...
J2EE allows you more flexibility certainly in terms of vendor support. J2EE has I think more of a community around it and more projects that can solve a multitide of problems. I think it is a bit easier and more natural to design in a cleaner and logical manner with J2EE than with .Net. I think .Net wins in tool maturity because I've yet to see anything that matches VS.Net overall (this is a highly debateable point to be sure). J2EE has had more time to get the kinks worked out and it's currently a very mature platform (although .Net out of the gate was considerably further along than Java was at the start, J2EE is still ahead).
.Net gives you some flexibility in terms of language support, although I think this is a bit overrated because even in the .Net shots I'm aware of they have generally standardized on one language or another (usually C#). True, there are some other language implemented in the JVM, but generally speaking it's a Java-only world.
J2EE might have the edge in terms of developing distributed applications, although I will say that my opinion is that even today with all the strides that have been made over the past year, .Net is still a superior platform for Web Services (interoperability issues aside, which aren't small concerns in some cases).
Overall, anyone that says J2EE is FAR superior to .Net, or anyone that says the opposite, is *probably* a zealot one way or the other and not really worth listening to. Anyone with an objective opinion who doesn't let their hatred of Redmond get in the way will generally say that the two are at least comperable in most ways. Hate MS all you want, but they really have done a great engineering job with .Net... Whether it's better than J2EE is vertainly up for debate (my opinion: I still give the Jave world the nod, but not by a huge margin).
Frank W. Zammetti Founder and Chief Software Architect Omnytex Technologies www.omnytex.com
From: Vic <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Reply-To: "Struts Users Mailing List" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: Advantages of J2EE w. Struts vs .NET ASP.NET Date: Mon, 13 Sep 2004 11:10:30 -0500
And of course... there's a little thing could profit.
Keep your hands of my stash. W/ any O/S, I get better quality and keep more of my penies, important for profesional developers.
But specificaly, I have not used VB or C# Express, so it's hard for me to compare detials. It be great to hear from somone who deplpyed both in production.
.V
Jim Barrows wrote:
-----Original Message----- From: news [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Behalf Of Anders Jacobsen Sent: Sunday, September 12, 2004 3:01 PM To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Advantages of J2EE w. Struts vs .NET ASP.NET
Hi
I think this place would be a good place to good some colored ;) comments on and Web applications implemented with J2EE w./ Struts and the same implemented with ASP.NET.
Microsoft people tends to have just one point-of-view so I hope I could find some people who preferable had experience with both frameworks.
I know itīs hard to find a winnner, but some con/pros from real developers would be of great value. The main functionality of the web application is edit/upate/delete operations and the like.
Well... let's start off with the fact that MS is NOT secure. If security is an issue, then MS's record to date is very worrisome. Yes, they've cleaned up their act a bit... however their problems are very deep in the fundamental way they do things. You can find some good discussions elsewhere.
Engineering would be next. In general the J2EE world's core tends to be better engineered. EJB being something of an exception, depending on who you talk to. I've seen more discussions of best practices and patterns on J2EE lists then I have on .Net lists. This may be more because I haven't chosen high quality lists. This may also be due to the higher incidence of trained monkey's in the MS world then software engineered.
Trained monkey's would be next. MS seems to attract developers who don't have any true understanding of how things work. I'm not sure why. It might be because they've made it so point and click that no one really understands what's going on, and even if they did they might not be able to do anything about it. I've seen far more "How do I show 1,000 items in a drop down list box?" type questions on MS lists then I have on Java lists. THe few I have seen, have all come from MS developers. MS has focused on providing cheap easy solutions, which is fine for the single computer model the has dominated so much of MS's history. There are very few cheap and easy solutions when developing enterprise wide software.
Last, and to a large degree, the most important is choice. I don't have to use Sun's VM. I don't have to use implementation of the JSP/Servlet spec. I don't have to use IBM's implementation either. I'm not tied to a database (ODBC is _NOT_ what I would call good database independance) vendor. I'm not tied to an OS Vendor, which means I'm not tied to a hardware platform. You can't run .Net on Sun, or AS400's or any hardware other then Intel. All of this means one thing... I can customize any Java based solution to fit any need.
Thanks in regards Anders
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