Hi Jack, I like you kind of "cashing out", but I think your diagram misses some points. In fact the view-controller itself is a view on the application model, where the business logic unit (which can be a component in a co-architecture i.e. session-bean) is the appropriate controller. So a complex mvc-architecture, contains more than one controller, but a grid of smaller mvc cycles, each of them being the view on the previous controller.
You are partially right talking about Webframeworks as not truly MVC, at least they do not have the possibility of callbacks from controller to view (see also subject/observer), but on the other hand, there is no need for explicit back calling opportunity issued by Gamma as he defined the MVC pattern. This why I think, we can still speak about webframeworks as MVC, keeping in mind, that they are solely client triggered. Regards Leon > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht----- > Von: Dakota Jack [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Gesendet: Montag, 15. November 2004 20:46 > An: Struts Users Mailing List; [EMAIL PROTECTED] > Betreff: Re: talking about paradigms > > The whole discussion about MVC and web frameworks is important, I > think, because not many cash it out when to do so (cash it out) would > be helpful for discussion. We might try some way of refering to this > such as WEBMVC. Anyway, the MVC pattern, taken literally, is > impossible in a web framework. What is possible is something like the > following where the arrows indicate where there is a coupling: > > View <==> Controller <==> Model > > Here the Model and the View are completely decoupled. But, even this > is almost a total representation of what is really going on. What is > really going on is that the response object is ultimately HTML and > that the JSP pages are part of creating the response object, so that > JSP pages inherently provide a smart-serverside View. This all is not > simple to cash out. I have a sample beginning of cashing this out at > http://131.191.32.112:8080/ , which, if others want to provide > alternative way of viewing this I will show them all. The most > important thing, I think, is to distinguish between the View data and > the Model data. That is the distinction, I think, that Craig makes in > JSTL between iteration and sql statements in JSP. > > Jack > > > -- > "You can't wake a person who is pretending to be asleep." > > ~Native Proverb~ > > "Each man is good in His sight. It is not necessary for eagles to be > crows." > > ~Hunkesni (Sitting Bull), Hunkpapa Sioux~ > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > > > since we started talking about paradigms... how does JSTL and > especially > > > EL fit into MVC paradigm? > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
