Can someone point to a nice explanation (preferably a graphic) that explains
how values are exposed to the OGNL by the S2 framework *and* the preferred
technique to access them?  S2 or JSTL tag?  What is the appropriate access
syntax?  I realize OGNL is a stand-alone facility, but it appears to be
tightly interlaced with S2.  Does OGNL overlap the familiar Servlet objects?
 I read the new tutorial Struts 2 + Spring 2 + JPA +
AJAX<http://struts.apache.org/2.x/docs/struts-2-spring-2-jpa-ajax.html>and
"Look mom my action is a simple POJO!  However, if you choose to go
the
vanilla interface route you give up many things inherited from
ActionSupport.  I started off using POJO Actions and quickly found myself
painted in a corner.  Beyond the trivial case, you discover this won't work!


Also, I am reading many threads where folks are confused by not having the
typical S1 objects (req, resp, form,session) available in their Action
classes and how they need to use the S2 "aware" interfaces.  But wait, next
I read how the interfaces are not *really* needed because you can always
grab these objects from the big fat ActionContext.

Let's face it... this is confusing!  I understand the interplay with
dependency injection and how the Action interfaces fills this contract.  Not
real sure about ModelDriven however (or is it ScopedModelDriven).  I also
realize the infamous OGNL has values pushed/popped on a stack and there are
a variety of ways to access them in other places.  What we need is a clear
example that is more involved than Person.java to realize how all the parts
interrelate.  If you look at the Struts 2 + Spring 2 + JPA + AJAX
<http://struts.apache.org/2.x/docs/struts-2-spring-2-jpa-ajax.html>you will
discover even this *fresh* example does not illustrate the S2 way of
minimizing configuration via Struts-style wildcards.  It's just bits and
parts -- and what the heck was the TopLink stuff?

Developers are pulling ideas from this half-documented site and pushing code
into their SCM.  I honestly think for S2 to be successful, we need a better
staring point as an example.  Many of the online samples return 404 when
clicked.  What we currently have is not representative of an enterprise
web-site.  Too trivial or too complex is too bad.  I would happily publish
my S2 web app as a demonstration once I am certain it utilizes the *correct*
S2 techniques and not just something I was able to get working.

Another thing is the subject line for these messages!  The answer to your
problem might be in this message or that, but you'll skip it because the
subject does not sound correlated to your issue.  I can hear it now –
"everyone save the messages and search your archives."

I want S2 to succeed as badly as those of you on this message group,
however, the hit-and-miss approach of coding, reading about a better
technique, refactoring, then coding it again is numbing.  We need a concise
and unified blueprint "that remains in lock-step with the prevailing S2
version" before building the web app!  If this is expected to compete with
the challengers, this needs to be completed soon.  I have a buddy doing RoR.
If what he is telling me about the ease of development is even 10% fact, it
won't be long before S2 is SYesterday.  10% is a wonderful Rate-of-Return

Wow, and I was simply looking to clarify OGNL.


--
Scott
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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