> Date: Mon, 8 Jun 2009 07:51:29 -0500 > Subject: Re: Training > From: stanl...@gmail.com > To: user@struts.apache.org > > I suspected this sort of training dialog was just beneath the surface. The > sad matter of fact is both Wes and Martin are spot on from each of their > perspectives. Wes works his tail off (I know because I have been reviewing > his new book) and Martin is a master technologist in business. MG>look at mysql ..best DB on the market but barely enough rev to keep lights on MG>what happened was the brilliant engineers at mysql gave away too much MG>without understanding you still need to make money..you need paying customers!
So who makes > the better argument? Actually, I think they are both right on and this is > what scares me. > > 1) Quality training by a seasoned professional is expensive and time > consuming to design and develop - notice the word design. Being prompted > through a PowerPoint presentation is only the tip of the iceberg and you > only know this is you have designed and developed training materials. As > Wes points out, you first need to know the topic inside out (time, time, > time) and then be a great communicator. I have seen my fair share of > seasoned pros on a topic who could not explain it to another human in twelve > months! Next, you need good tools and the time to learn them. Mastering an > effective graphics applications is no walk in the park yet illustrations are > effective and necessary. When it comes to lab materials, their cumulative > nature throughout a course, and the degree of difficulty that neither runs > the class twelve hours a day nor leaves the students twiddling their thumbs > is an *art* not a *science*. MG>you only know what students learned by getting feedback (chatting or HW) MG>in the public sector they use pop quizes but students are not fond of that MG>perhaps bruce can elaborate what feedback mechanism he uses? And the 201 level class that follows the 101 > level must not only take all of this into account, but also leverage the > prerequisite course itself to minimize mental gear changing and maximize > content and context flow. MG>i present inheritance today i use it for designing GL to Subledger accounting MG>or OrderHeader to Order LI design tommorrow i have validated they know the MG>concept of inheritance..onto to encapsulation.. MG>then i'll toss in a struts Action with namespace for a more concrete example > 2) Now to Martin's argument. Joe public looks around (pronounced Google) > and expects to find free or dirt cheap videos, presentations including > sample code, and emails where they can get free help. I call this theme > "you get what you pay for." I have followed a couple JQuery training > avenues that fit this mold and after several hours jumping around, I can't > hit my ass with both hands! The next JQuery freebie I click on suggests > techniques that are in direct opposition to yesterdays free lecture! To > paint an anology let's suppose a Struts 2 newbie follows a freebie course at > Joe's Training Emporium where Joe has barely figured out how to code > himself. But hey, his stuff contains jars enough to compile so he must be > an expert! Between the kick-ass Flash graphics his brother-in-law put > together and an ass-load of sample code, you now have a web shopping site > with JSP files and Action classes that average 385 lines of code in each > execute() method -- but it works! You ground your mental web around this > bag-of-ass design/code and are later asked to make a couple simple changes > to it. Let me speed the analogy up a little so I am not late for work this > morning -- after several weeks of spinning and subsequently being fired > because you have been revealed as the hack you are, you decide (hey > unemployment causes you to do creative things) to actually drop a few bucks > on education, either through published material or a formal class. You > realize their are tiers and dependency injection. You see that rolling > hand-coded JDBC code is no longer in style and that while writing Java code > on a web page is possible, it comes back to bite your ass like a coiled up > cobra! MG>taking a training class in tapestry when i know the only apps written are in OR MG>maybe no MG>taking a training class in JSF when i know the only apps written are around santa MG>clara..maybe not MG>taking a Spring training class from one of the world's masters Juergen-sign me up! MG>jsp JDBC with no connection-pools or resource config is NOT for the light o'heart! MG>trying to shoe-horn that into webapp server will be a real-challenge > Great and effective training is expensive and time consuming. My > step-father is a single proprietor plumber with one of those cool vans full > of tools and we often discuss his investment in his business. If he does not > dig deep into his own pocket to keep himself and his tool van sharply honed > for his customers, his competitor will put him out of business. Does he > like spending money no training and tools? He says its cheaper to pay his > dues to remain a professional than it would be to buy a freeezer and convert > over to an ice-cream and lollipop vendor. > > You decide -- professional or a clown driving a musical van. > > Peace, > Scott > > On Sun, Jun 7, 2009 at 1:54 PM, Martin Gainty <mgai...@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > <font size="1">you cannot guarantee something you have no control</font> > > scott could you make sure that gets into brochure? > > > > vielen danke/thanks, > > Martin > > ______________________________________________ > > Verzicht und Vertraulichkeitanmerkung > > > > Diese Nachricht ist vertraulich. Sollten Sie nicht der vorgesehene > > Empfaenger sein, so bitten wir hoeflich um eine Mitteilung. Jede unbefugte > > Weiterleitung oder Fertigung einer Kopie ist unzulaessig. Diese Nachricht > > dient lediglich dem Austausch von Informationen und entfaltet keine > > rechtliche Bindungswirkung. Aufgrund der leichten Manipulierbarkeit von > > E-Mails koennen wir keine Haftung fuer den Inhalt uebernehmen. > > > > > > > > > > > > > Date: Sun, 7 Jun 2009 14:38:22 -0400 > > > From: newton.d...@yahoo.com > > > To: user@struts.apache.org > > > Subject: Re: Training > > > > > > Martin Gainty wrote: > > > > wes-I cant speak for Motorola 64k code (MAC) as i have yet to coded > > > > for that platform but it sounds challenging does Struts work on > > Motorola > > > > > > .... > > > > > > Old Macs used the 68K. Struts works on Java and in app containers, not > > > on specific processors. > > > > > > And coding for the 68K is substantially less challenging than the x86. > > > > > > > Price: > > > > the instructor needs to readily demonstrate if you take my course you > > > > will double your output with facts and figures and testimony to > > justify.. > > > > > > That is not possible. You cannot guarantee something you cannot control. > > > I can think of several people that I could sit down for a week-long > > > course and they'd still be worthless as developers at the end of it. > > > > > > Dave > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > > > To unsubscribe, e-mail: user-unsubscr...@struts.apache.org > > > For additional commands, e-mail: user-h...@struts.apache.org > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Windows Live™ SkyDrive™: Get 25 GB of free online storage. > > http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009 _________________________________________________________________ Insert movie times and more without leaving Hotmail®. http://windowslive.com/Tutorial/Hotmail/QuickAdd?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_HM_Tutorial_QuickAdd_062009
