was just poking around for an example ontology that one might play with... the BBC looks like a good bet [1].
I suspect that there's some way to access the semantic web that drives its web pages in a machine processable form. This guy [2] seems to have published some useful stuff in this area (works for the Beeb). Dan [1] http://www.bbc.co.uk/ontologies/bbc [2] http://raimond.me.uk/pubs/ On 3 November 2015 at 02:16, Stephen Cameron <[email protected]> wrote: > On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 11:24 AM, Dan Haywood <[email protected] > > > wrote: > > > On 2 November 2015 at 23:27, Stephen Cameron <[email protected] > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > What relevance of this too Apache Isis? Well you nearly got it straight > > > off, that the Isis meta-model is a model that maybe can be exported as > > OWL. > > > I don't think so as its more of logical model than a conceptual one. I > am > > > thinking the other way around, that a conceptual model in OWL, or > > something > > > else, could be the basis of the Isis meta-model. > > > > > > > > > Also very interesting. I think this would be doable... further > thoughts > > below. > > > > > > > > > > > > > The thing that led me to Isis was that half of this picture is already > > > done, the model to UI part, I thought maybe I could add the other half > > > (person to model)? > > > > > > Yes, perhaps... > > > > Now that we have view models as first-class citizens, I could imagine an > > Isis application where every semantic resource could be surfaced as an > view > > model (@DomainObject(nature=EXTERNAL_ENTITY) is probably how I would > model > > it). > > > > Or, an alternative would be treat them as regular persisted entities via > > DataNucleus, and use DN's Store API to know how to query a semantic web > of > > resources. However, that's one extra layer to worry about which may or > may > > not work. Sticking with Isis view models is probably easier. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Also the meta-model in Isis is a OO model, which is > > > nearly what you want perhaps? > > > > > > > > As you know, the way in which Isis builds up its metamodel is quite > > flexible (the FacetFactory API). In Isis' default programming model > > there is a "special" FacetFactory called > > "PropertyOrCollectionIdentifyingFacetFactory" that is used to infer the > > initial "know-what" structure of each domain class. I could imagine a > > similar facet factory for the semantic web that queried the OWL metamodel > > (?) to ask which triples exist for a particular resource. > > > > > > > > > > > > That is what I want to get a handle on via > > > this course. > > > > > > > > Good stuff; will hear back presently no doubt! > > > > Thx > > Dan > > > > > > Encouraging, I have browsed around in the meta-model code, but very > casually! > > I am hoping that others might like to work through a design on this mailing > list, hence my suggestion of doing the course, so we are all on the same > page (mostly) at the start. > > Open-source CMS systems have gone down the semantic path a bit, such as > semantic wikis. The idea of using a conceptual model as the interface to a > database has a long history but never seems to make it as a mainstream > thing (See for example Object-Role-Modeling). Microsoft has Entity > Framework but that still seems a logical model to me, a tool to help > programmers. > > But I believe DDD has this conceptual model idea at its core in terms of > the Ubiquitous Language. That by being precise about the meaning of terms > new insights are gained. > > That OWL is widely used might make it a good choice. What the user sees > does not necessarily have to be lots of URIs, these are essentially just > names within namespaces (same as class names within a package names), its > just a means of classification. > > Cheers > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > Steve > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Tue, Nov 3, 2015 at 6:25 AM, Dan Haywood < > > [email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > Thanks for the precis, Cesar... very interesting. > > > > > > > > Clearly in Isis we have a lot of the information in our metamodel > that > > > > could be the input for a semantic web ontology; I'd appreciate > > > > understanding how this information is "exported" such that an Isis > app > > > can > > > > also be considered as a "semantic web app" (if that's even a term...) > > > > > > > > cheers > > > > Dan > > > > > > > > > > > > On 2 November 2015 at 15:59, Cesar Lugo <[email protected]> > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Dan, I think this is an important and very interesting topic. I > have > > > some > > > > > basic knowledge of the semantic web concepts, and I have done some > > > > > significant prototyping using semantic web tools, just far from > being > > > an > > > > > expert or knowledgeable person. As far as I k now, the semantic web > > > > concept > > > > > was developed by the father of the www, and it adds semantics to > the > > > web > > > > > content, and to the web applications as well. This has also been > > called > > > > the > > > > > Web 3.0, and the semantic web technologies go from adding semantics > > to > > > > the > > > > > web pages, to build entire semantic applications. > > > > > > > > > > On the UI web pages side, it adds semantics embedded within the > HTML > > > with > > > > > semantic extensions, so a browser would be able to know more > > > information > > > > > about the semantics of that page. For example, when you look at an > > > > amazon's > > > > > web page and find a book, you know that you are looking at a book, > > you > > > > know > > > > > what a book is, you know it's about growing apples, and you know > some > > > > > numbers besides it are the different prices of the book, and the > text > > > > > besides it is an overview of the book's contents. The browser, > > > currently > > > > in > > > > > web 2.0, does not know any of those semantics, but just the page > > > content > > > > in > > > > > terms of things like fields, controls and links. The semantic web > > lets > > > > the > > > > > browser infer all those semantics from the web page, buy using > > > ontologies > > > > > and extended dictionaries (they are currently creating ontologies > > based > > > > on > > > > > Wikipedia content, but structured so the systems can understand and > > > infer > > > > > meaning, not just content). The idea is that having the browser > know > > > the > > > > > semantics, it will help interact among other systems in a more > > > semantical > > > > > way, like, for example, if you are interested in growing apples, > then > > > you > > > > > might also be interested in growing some kinds of organic food. > > > > > > > > > > Then, at the domain logic layer, you use ontologies (expressed in > > RDFs) > > > > to > > > > > represent your domain, which allows you to re-use existing > ontologies > > > for > > > > > common topics like a customer, a vendor, a company, the > relationship > > > > among > > > > > people (like the FOAF friend of a friend ontology), a product, and > > > more. > > > > > Then, there is a language called SPARQL, similar to SQL, but works > at > > > the > > > > > ontology level. All that and more lets you create your apps with > > > semantic > > > > > content all over the app, not only at the UI. Your application will > > be > > > > more > > > > > knowledgeable about the semantics of the topics (domain objects) > > within > > > > it, > > > > > so you can use knowledge management methods to define and manage > your > > > > > domain logic and your exposed content, and interact with other > > systems > > > > at a > > > > > semantic level. > > > > > > > > > > Cesar. > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Dan Haywood [mailto:[email protected]] > > > > > Sent: Monday, November 2, 2015 2:52 AM > > > > > To: users > > > > > Subject: Re: Course of Interest > > > > > > > > > > Shall be interested to hear your thoughts on this... not a subject > I > > > have > > > > > any knowledge of. > > > > > > > > > > cheers > > > > > Dan > > > > > > > > > > On 2 November 2015 at 02:40, Stephen Cameron < > > > [email protected] > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > Hello Apache Isis Community, > > > > > > > > > > > > I am about to start an free online course on Semantic Web > > > > > > Technologies. At the moment the connection to Isis is not clear, > > but > > > I > > > > > > have ideas. I am doing this course to see if my ideas have any > > > > > > relationship to reality, specifically in regard to conceptual > > models. > > > > > > > > > > > > https://open.hpi.de/courses/semanticweb2015?locale=en > > > > > > > > > > > > Regards > > > > > > Steve Cameron > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > --- > > > > > This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus > software. > > > > > https://www.avast.com/antivirus > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >
