yes, I read thru the documentation on at peopleware.be too.

this is pretty good, including some tips and best practice.

~manchi

On Jan 23, 2006, at 8:29 PM, Lutz Fechner wrote:

Your wiki linked to the Maven wiki hosted by codehaus.org which linked to

http://cvs.peopleware.be/training/maven/maven2/index.html

Which doesn't seem to be that bad. Seems to help.

By

Lutz

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Eric Redmond [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Gesendet: Samstag, 21. Januar 2006 03:58
An: Maven Users List
Betreff: Re: Worst documentation in the whole apache projects

As an ademdum, I'm not really a mvn zelot. I was actually so paranoid that M2 would have a disasterous lack of documentation, I began my own document wiki right when M2 was released (http://www.propellors.net/ wiki/). After a couple weeks, it was clear that the core team were focused on documenting, and were making great progress... so I closed it down.


On 1/20/06, Eric Redmond <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

I've been digging into the bowels of Maven for months now, and really,
the documentation is ok. There are a few short-commings (the--more or
less--lack of comprehensive Plexus docs, for one), but considering the scope that this project has (huge), the speed in which it has begun to
mature (fast), and the number of dedicated core developers (few), I'm
amazed at the progress. I know of two books in the works right now,
and I'm certain that more will come. Look at ant! Very few people
understood it at the time, because it was so far removed from Make. A
few books came out, and viola! Now its the basis for comparison.

Luckly, there is an active user community you can ask specific
questions to, in the mean time :)

Eric

On 1/20/06, Jeff Jensen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Examples are one thing, reference info is another.  I think anyone
can contribute both.

Particularly, if even a small number of users would look at the pom:
http://maven.apache.org/maven-model/maven.html

read the description of each element, and submit patches to improve
it to this JIRA or different ones:
http://jira.codehaus.org/browse/MNG-1479

a lot of clarity would arrive for all of us.  Detailed explanations
of elements go a long way to answering "what to do".

Many users have solid M2 experience in one or more facets of M2;
many have "figured it out the hard way"; a way to contribute to the
product is via that knowledge through doc improvements.  Even just
adding a one sentence clarification can save someone 2 hours of
experimentation and/or emailing this list.

This list spends more time writing and wading through the repeating
large email volume than updating docs for all to use and reduce the
need for email list questions.


-----Original Message-----
From: Ramin Farhanian [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: Friday, January 20, 2006 12:31 AM
To: Maven Users List
Subject: Re: Worst documentation in the whole apache projects

Afkham,
We might contribute some examples to Maven team but It's better that
we do not expose it ourselves.
Because Most of maven users might have understood a version of truth
about Maven mechanism. I really like the team to give Maven aware
people a homework example. This way they dont start samples from the
scratch. And this way some people can help...

regards,
Ramin

--- Afkham Azeez < [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

Hi Folks,
I sincerely wish that everybody commenting on the bad documetation
will at least try to contribute some documentation.
After all, most of
you have figured out stuff the hard way. Why not share it with the
community? Why keep on blaming the developers for insufficient
documentation, and not do anything about it? Ask not what Maven
can do

for you but what yu can do for Maven :) Long live Maven

Regards
Azeez

On 1/20/06, Ramin Farhanian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

 The nature of an open souce project is not an
excuse
not to document. We are facing 50 different MVC frameworks. What
if they don't have documentation?
Open source projects are there to let all of us
live
in a more harmonized, more peaceful, ever evolving world. You
code here today in Maven, I will code tomorrow in Facelet. We
are all interconnected.
 I should say to Maven team that if you see this thread is
growing, It's because you are creating a great tool and we all
need it. It's because We
have
tried to use it and to enjoy its great features
but We
faced problems. This documentation has been on our nerves. I
wish you all guys to continue evolving
this
tool and wish for all of us that you Maven team
find a
good one to document in a brain friendly way.
 I dont agree with yet another wiki. Unfortunately
it
should be done by a group of people that
communicate
eachother and are master in the tool....

Regards,
Ramin
ps, again I wish Kathy Sierra could help in documentation.


--- Richard Allen < [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

I'm amazed at the lack of appreciation some
people
have for getting
something for nothing! Maven is FREE! The
developers
don't get paid to
write the code, much less the documentation, or
even
to respond to lousy
user email. They do it all in their free time.
However, I bet Roberto is
getting paid to work on his J2EE project. Maven hasn't been
around as long as many other Apache open-source projects.
Open-source projects
typically have poor documentation while the code
is
maturing. Like all
open-source projects, if you want to really get
to
know the product,
then read the code! It'll make you a better programmer. If you
don't have time to read the code, then you shouldn't
be
using open-source
projects. At least not until the project has matured.

I'm working on a build for a complex web
application
and I've found that
Maven solves problems that Ant doesn't have a solution for. In
particular, Maven handles transitive
dependencies
and is multiproject
aware. If you are using Ant alone, then you have
to
write your own
solution for these things. For things that Ant
has
but Maven is
currently lacking, you can write your own
plugin(s)
or use the
maven-antrun-plugin.

Richard Allen


Nanamura, Roberto wrote:

Hi,

Is there any way to improve all the
documentation
for the Maven.

I will not use Maven anymore since there are a
bunch of thing missing
from the documentation (and a lot of things do
not
work like the J2EE
archetype which is nowhere to be find and I am
not
the only one to
complain about it).

It is good for a simple project (then again,
why
should I need maven for
a simple Hello World project?). But if you add
a
J2EE layer or other
components, it simpy does not have document
(for
example no document for
the topic: "Guide to creating a multi-module
build"). Then how should I
create a multi-project maven? What is this
artifactId and groupID? What
the hell it keeps on going to the
repo1.maven.org
repository for my
sub-projects? What are the examples? No
samples?

The reference is a joke. How can a reference be
so
laconious? It is a
reference so every tag in the XML must have a
good
description (even the
description in the generated xml is better than
the
reference!).

I do not recommend Maven to anyone starting a
serious project for lack
of documentation and erroneous documentation.

I spent the whole day try to make it work for a
simple J2EE project,
then I had to google it several times for each
error (it should be in
the document web-site).
Whereas I would take one hour to create the
directories, my build and
deployment ant targets.

Thanks but I'd rather do not use it,

Roberto









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--
Thanks
Afkham Azeez


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