----- Original Message -----
From: "Christopher Schultz" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "Tomcat Users List" <users@tomcat.apache.org>
Sent: Tuesday, August 26, 2008 6:33 PM
Subject: Re: Struts vs JSF (poll?)
What do you consider the "TC MVC model"? Do you just mean "use servlets
configured in web.xml and use your own redirects/forwards from within
them"?
Been googling like crazy trying to find the great article that got me onto
it...
Its Goslings buddy, but for the love of me I cant remember where I saw it.
But there are lots of related MVC in TC articles out there also.
Yes, it uses forwards, the idea that JSP is just display and servlet is
logic.
It actually also had a comparison to many frameworks as well.
But there was no ultimate conclusion... its different stokes for different
folks.
If the original poster just see's that there are more frameworks
than good looking australian women... we've done a good thng ;)
Starting without a framework, make give you flexibility, but that initial
'get going' effort is substantial.
I'm not condeming any of them... but I do see newbies making terrible
mistakes.
The famous one is that for some reason users coming from the ASP world build
entire apps in JSP... no servlets.
And then worse still, they come to the conclusion that TC/Servlets/Java is
crap.
Thats when I start yelling MVC... as soon as they see the servlet/JSP combo
working, theres a big
eurika... then if they decide to use struts... at least they see it, and
know why.
Then I monitor the NB mailing lists... and yes you right, from a technical
perspective, that VWP framework
is amazing stuff, but a blind newbie is going dig a big hole... its not fool
proof.
You can actually watch them get into trouble... "I got some HTML pages and I
cant get them to work" ;)
Its very subjective and theres lots of traps for a newbie that hasnt done
their homework...
If everyone with a framework posts in this thread, thats a good thing.
My angle is that I try keep whatever I use open... so I try reduce
frameworks to tools, and get them working together.
I do use things like GWT and VWP, but not like they where meant to be
used... I tool em, bring em back to my model.
Anyway, once a newbie starts to get it, they start distinguishing tools from
frameworks and they get smart about...
I didnt want to say it, but the one thing I was trying to say... its
subjective opinion, is that when it comes to langauge
design, and tools at that level, Sun is terrific, their Java is awesome...
but when it comes to more powerful tools, bordering
on frameworks, I dont think so.... ( I feel a new cold war coming ;)
... and I was trying to say... Apache is a big beautiful tool box... you
dont really want to shut it out ;)
Any body guards out there ;)
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
HARBOR : http://www.kewlstuff.co.za/index.htm
The most powerful application server on earth.
The only real POJO Application Server.
See it in Action : http://www.kewlstuff.co.za/cd_tut_swf/whatisejb1.htm
---------------------------------------------------------------------------
---------------------------------------------------------------------
To start a new topic, e-mail: users@tomcat.apache.org
To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
