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Actually I looking at America through American eyes.
But I see things differently then my neighbours because I have taken off my rose
coloured glasses and see the real world. Not the world I'm told by the
government and media that I'm suppose to see.
Take off your rose coloured glasses and you may see the
dangers lurking about. This is not an Europe vs. America issue. This
is an issue of the common man who fought to defend freedom and democracy, and
the neo-cons who come as wolves in sheep's clothing determined to take it all
away. This banter just may save your life someday.
Euric
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Tuesday, 2004-03-30 09:41
Subject: RE: [USMA:29367] RE: Canadian
metric muddle evident
Euric,
This
is true for you as you are looking at us through European glasses.
Likewise, my American glasses blind me to many thoughts/ideas/actions of my
European brothers.
I
subscribe to this USMA list server because I thought it was a unified forum to
encourage SI within the USA. In my opinion this banter does not
encourage anything, but rather divides.
Thank you,
Mike
Panfil
-----Original
Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of
Chimpsarecute
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 23:18
To:
U.S. Metric Association
Subject: [USMA:29367] RE: Canadian metric
muddle evident
That may have been the way it was in the past.
But present trends indicate that the US system is about to undergo a major
change. The people either willingly or unwillingly are going to
surrender their freedoms for "security". Many freedoms are already
being taken away. The new constitution is rearing its ugly head in the
form of the "Patriot Acts".
The government will be able to control via
the military and police by declaring all forms of crime to be
terrorist acts. If you steal, you are not a thief, you are a
terrorist. If you kill, you are not a murderer, you are a
terrorist. If you have sexual relations outside of marriage, you are
not an adultery/adulteress, you are a terrorist. By branding you a
terrorist, the government can hold you and try you with out a jury or a
lawyer.
Any word spoken or written against the government
is going to be considered a terrorist act. And like sheep to the
slaughter, the people of the US will surrender their freedoms for promised
security. Falsely believing that if they watch their Ps and Qs, they
won't be bothered. Remember the words of Nietzsche:
Niemand ist hoffnungsloser verskalvt als der, der
F�lschlich glaubt frei zu sein.
No one is more hopelessly enslaved, then they who
falsely believe they are free.
Truer words have never been spoken.
We will all experience in our lifetime, in the next
few years, a transformation of the US from democracy to fascism. It
has already started.
Compare the burning of the Reichstag in 1934 to the 11
Sep 2001, and the Patriot Acts to the Enabling Acts. history does
repeat itself.
Euric
----- Original Message -----
Sent: Monday, 2004-03-29 22:41
Subject: [USMA:29366] RE: Canadian metric muddle
evident
This view is a
rather reduced and over-simplified view of how things work in
the
U.S. What you fail to recognize is the role that the states play in
the
scenario. Unlike Canada and many other federal republics which
have a
top-down approach to governance, the power of the federal
government in the
U.S. is derived from the states themselves. The
states' power is derived
from the people. The concept of states vs.
federal power has been a point
of contention for the past 200 years or so
to the point that a civil war was
fought over it. Americans seem to
divide on the role of state vs. federal
government with those who are
liberal wanting an expanded federal
governmental role and conservatives,
a state role, albeit a reduced one.
Home rule is very important to many
people as they feel they are more
empowered at the local level than at
the federal. While most people
recognize the need for the federal
government in areas such as defense,
monetary policy and international
relations, they feel that the state is a
far better forum for issues such
as education, economic development and
transportation.
So,
where does that leave issues like metrication? I think we can all
agree
that it is indeed, a national level issue with the national economy
at
stake, but as Carleton stated below, when it gets personal, people
don't
seem to want to be bothered. Chalk it up to human
inertia. The answer of
course, is education. We need to make
people understand why it is important
to think of metric in everyday
terms and to make the transition as natural
and painless as
possible. Canada has succeeded in one area that the U.S.
can't seem
to budge on--highways. If we could get people to accept the idea
of
metric-signed highways, we are more than halfway through the battle.
It
is the biggest nut to crack because it comes with the biggest visible
price
tag. As Congress needs to make such a move mandatory, it may
not happen for
some while. My guess is that one state will
eventually take the mantle and
start then others will fall in line, thus
making it a bottom-up approach.
It would have to be a state like
California though as California sets trends
for the rest of the country
for things like highway construction.
Until such time as people
change their views on federal vs. state vs. local,
our progress on
metrication will continue to be evolutionary,
not
revolutionary.
Phil
-----Original Message-----
From:
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf
Of Carleton
MacDonald
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 10:16 PM
To: U.S. Metric
Association
Subject: [USMA:29365] Re: Canadian metric muddle
evident
There is a great difference between the US view of
government, and the
Canadian/European view of government. While
there is of course every
variety of opinion in both areas, and plenty of
those who do not agree with
the prevailing view, nonetheless --
In
the USA many view government as the enemy and the stifler of enterprise
-
"they". Americans do NOT want the government telling them what to
do. The
fact that contention keeps much legislation from passing is
viewed as good
as it keeps the government weak. Goverment is
expected only to provide for
national defense (until one is eligible for
Social Security). Government
trying to make metrication happen is
viewed as government telling you what
to do.
In Canada and Europe
many view government more as a facilitator, something
working for the
common good - "us". Government is expected to provide for
the
common welfare and keep corporations and individuals from becoming
too
powerful. Government making metrication happen is viewed as
government
making things better.
As someone else wrote,
metrication starts to get personal when it hits
retail. No one
cares how big a soda bottle is, but they don't like learning
a new way to
buy bananas, and they will turn on government if it tries to do
this --
and there are those who will take advantage of this; Mulroney in
Canada
in 1983 is a good example.
Carleton
-----Original
Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Behalf Of Chimpsarecute
Sent:
Saturday, March 27, 2004 11:52
To: U.S. Metric Association
Subject:
[USMA:29315] Re: Canadian metric muddle evident
Han,
I
don't think economic status is the reason for achievement or lack of
it.
It has more to do with arrogance and attitude. The so-called
poor nations
were colonies of the so-called rich nations.
Metrication of former colonies
was seen as an attitude of
independence. The colonizing countries were
empires and their
arrogance dictates that their ways are the best and
everyone must follow
them.
Many in the UK still think of them selves as being part of the
empire and as
rulers. They hate the EU and metric because it means
that others are
telling them what to do instead of the other way
around. Metrication is a
symbol that their ways are no longer the
best and no longer accepted. They
are being forced to adopt the
ways of former enemies and rivals. This is
something they can not
bear.
The US is now where the UK was just prior to WWII. The
neo-con masters are
trying to establish a new world order based on US
domination. The Iraq war
was meant to secure gulf state's oil under
the dollar hegemony. The
creation of the euro and the strong
stability of the euro has threatened the
dollar hegemony and has forced
the neo-cons to accelerate their
globalisation efforts. By
globalisation, I'm not speaking of world trade,
but neo-con control of
the of the world and its economy.
The neo-cons in an effort to secure
vital assets under their control are
putting into practice the means to
limit democracy and to turn the US (and
the world) into a police state
under their control. If their agenda is
pro-metric, then shortly
after they assume full power, they will under force
of severe punishment
or death, metricate the US. If they are anti-metric,
or neutral,
then no enforced metrication will take place.
Can you imagine being
sent to a concentration camp for being a supporter of
metric or even an
opponent? It can happen and it will. See:
http://www.angelfire.com/music2/fullcircle/con1.html
http://www.freedomfiles.org/war/fema.htm
Americans who have been so conditioned to believe that they live
if the land
of the free and home of the brave, and that their democracy
is written in
stone, will be the easiest people to enslave. While
they are being lead by
the tens of thousands into the camps, they will be
shaking their heads in
disbelief, because something this sinister just
can not happen in the USA.
How will they achieve this? By
labelling all crimes as terrorism, and
charging every criminal (in their
eyes) as terrorists. If the neo-cons are
in fact anti-metric, we
could right now be on their list as a terrorist
group and the USMA may be
labelled a terrorist organisation. At least you
Han, living in the
EU would be immune from their control for a short
time.
Euric
----- Original Message -----
From: "Han
Maenen" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
"U.S. Metric Association" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent:
Saturday, 2004-03-27 06:47
Subject: [USMA:29313] Re: Canadian metric
muddle evident
> This is exactly the reason why I do not
believe in 'democracy' in such
> cases. It leads to muddle and endless
confusion for decades. I hope that
it
> will work in the USA, where
many people are suspicious of what the
> government does. It evidently
does not work in Canada and Britain, and it
> did not work in many
nations that went metric in the past.
> Many nations tried the
voluntary approach, but as soon as metrication
> reached the retail
trades, trouble started and this is what happened in
> Britain and
Canada. In France it almost destroyed the metric system. Only
> strict
laws that forced trade (not private citizens!) to use metric ended
>
the muddle.
> In Canada some conservative politicians thought of the
ballot box and
> climbed the anti-metric bandwagon, with this madness
as a result.
> I am glad that we have not adopted the euro the
'democratic' way. We would
> have double pricing and double currencies
for decades. On all other issues
> we are democracies.
> Years
ago I read a Letter to the Editor in the Guardian, where a British
>
person reported that the street markets in Kenya went metric almost
>
overnight with no difficulties whatsoever, no consumer and traders
>
resistance. This also seems to have been the case in other Third
World
> countries. Why can these poor nations achieve what some rich
nations
cannot?
>
> Han
>
>
> -----
Original Message -----
> From: "Ezra Steinberg" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "U.S. Metric Association" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Sent:
Friday, 2004-03-26 23:14
> Subject: [USMA:29310] Canadian metric
muddle evident
>
>
> > Someone posted recently an
article from a newspaper in the prairie
> provinces arguing against
the current Canadian metric muddle and
> recommending going back to
Imperial or completely forward to metric. (Hard
> for me to see how
they can go back given all the current investment in
> metric, like
speed limit and distance signs, and the fact that the last
> hold-out,
the USA, is inching -- yes, that's deliberate on my part ---
> towards
conversion.)
> >
> > I saw this quite clearly on the
Science Channel last night on a program
> that talked about monster
trucks. (No, not what you see at the speedway on
> Saturday night, but
the huge multi-million dollar trucks that are used in
> mining, etc.)
They shot the program in Canada, and the engineers and other
> folks
interviewed kept bouncing around from metric to Imperial.
The
pattern
> I thought I discerned was that they used metric for
short distances
(metres)
> , liquid quantities (litres), and
temperature (degrees Celsius) and
Imperial
> for longer distances
(miles).
> >
> > Come to think of it, that sounds a lot
like what most Brits seem to be
> doing these days, n'est-ce pas?
Don't they have a muddle there, too?? ;-)
> >
> > Still,
there miles ahead of US! (Still deliberate ... )
> >
>
>
>
>
>
>
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