I understand your point but with respect an aeroplane is not a baby and I was talking about figures for human weight. A professional that can 'scale' someone by using imperial or metric will clearly see exaggerative mistakes. I'm 12st 6lb. If a professional looked at me with 126kg in his head I would query his training!
From: [email protected] To: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: Re: [USMA:46775] Re: babies produced, UK Date: Sat, 27 Feb 2010 08:07:13 +0000 Stephen said: "With an immersion into body weights as professionals have in this field I'd find it hard to believe that those same professionals would make such huge errors. " Many years ago, an Air Canada Boeing 767 was refueled in kg on a flight from Vancouver to Toronto (AC had converted to metric). The refueling system was still calculated in lbs. The operator made a wrong conversion - dividing the required kg by 2.2 instead of multiplying to calculate the lbs. The plane's fuel gauges weren't working, so the flight deck didn't actually know how much fuel the plane had on board. The aircraft ran out of fuel over the Canadian prairies. Fortunately the first officer knew of a disused military airfield in Manitoba, and the aircraft made a spectacular dead stick landing (quite a few tires got burst!). In spite of the fact that the feul system operator should have realised that the time taken to refuel was only one fifth of what it should have been; in spite of the fact that the plane was much lighter than it should have been (and therefore reached take-off speed much sooner than it should have), not one of these professionals - fuel system operator, captain or first officer - realised this at the time. Professionals DO make those kinds of measurement errors Stephen. All the more reason to have ONE measurement system, and that it must be metric. John F-L ----- Original Message ----- From: Stephen Humphreys To: U.S. Metric Association Sent: Friday, February 26, 2010 10:25 PM Subject: [USMA:46775] Re: babies produced, UK "Steve, since the surgeon and midwife who delivered your son discussed his weight in imperial units, would this place the hospital in the 10% who keep their scales permanently switched to imperial units? For the sake of your family’s health I trust not – such action are indicative of poor management." - No I'm almost positive it was in metric - the nurse did something to convert it to imperial. I can't remember in detail if this was via a switch or conversion chart - try to remember what I was observing ;-) And I really don't think imperial will damage the health of my baby - but thanks for the concern. "The Government will be issuing a statement shortly on the matter – I only trust that hospitals will take heed of the advise and not wait to be rapped over the knuckles by a coroner following in incorrect dosage caused for instance by a the scales reading 11 stone 4 lbs and somebody recording that as 114 kg. (For the record 11 st 4 lbs is 71 kg)." With an immersion into body weights as professionals have in this field I'd find it hard to believe that those same professionals would make such huge errors. I've heard of the 'decimal point error' though - although I won't blame metric for that. Martin - please take what I say with some thought - you have been brought up in places like S.Africa with hard laws forcing metric usage regarding things like this. Stones & pounds are really deeply entrenched in the psyche of most Brits. It is an example of why the UK *WOULD NOT* quickly go metric if the USA goes metric - they have never(?) had the stone. I really think that forcing people not to use stones will backfire on pushing metric as a preferred system. You don't have to believe me but it's my honestly held opinion. From: [email protected] To: [email protected]; [email protected] Subject: RE: [USMA:46745] Re: babies produced, UK Date: Fri, 26 Feb 2010 21:10:59 +0000 It might interest readers to know that the matter of hospital scales was debated in the British House of Lords this week. A full transcript of the debate can be found at http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/ld200910/ldhansrd/text/100225-0001.htm#10022584000562. One of the important comments was “Does she [the minister] further understand that last year, LACORS, the Local Authorities Co-ordinators of Regulatory Services, carried out a major survey that found that 30 per cent of weighing machines in hospitals were switchable between metric and imperial units and that a staggering 10 per cent were permanently switched to imperial units only?” Steve, since the surgeon and midwife who delivered your son discussed his weight in imperial units, would this place the hospital in the 10% who keep their scales permanently switched to imperial units? For the sake of your family’s health I trust not – such action are indicative of poor management. The following comment was also made: “Is she aware that the importance of this topic relates to the fact that the dosage of many powerful drugs is now calculated according to the weight in kilograms of the recipient? If, in error, such a calculation used imperial units, there would be a serious risk of under-dosage or, more importantly, major over-dosage”. The Government will be issuing a statement shortly on the matter – I only trust that hospitals will take heed of the advise and not wait to be rapped over the knuckles by a coroner following in incorrect dosage caused for instance by a the scales reading 11 stone 4 lbs and somebody recording that as 114 kg. (For the record 11 st 4 lbs is 71 kg). Comment sponsored by the UKMA can be found at http://www.metricviews.org.uk. From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Stephen Humphreys Sent: 23 February 2010 22:04 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:46745] Re: babies produced, UK I'm watching Derren Brown on TV, Martin - are you following his footsteps in the psychic department? ;-) Yes - we had a boy by C-section 9 months ago! Ta-da!!!! Some points to keep on topic (and you only have my word on this but I hope you take into consideration other points I've made in the past!) This in on reflection - I was otherwise pre-occupied at the time! And speechless! (40 mins earlier I was 'safely' at work none the wiser). When he was born he was put on some scales which were metric - the nurse said "he's a good weight for 1 month early" The C-section surgeon (and this is important) who was *not British* asked how much he weighed. The nurse responded "6lb 3" to which the surgeon said - "that's good". His (the baby's) records have an entry for both metric and imperial throughout. I have no doubt that the 'official' figures are metric but the records show both. Before he was born my wife went for a blood test at the hospital. I saw the needle. Let me explain - I have a needle phobia. Immediately I had to leave the room. I wandered about but started feeling faint (I've never fainted but I felt very heavy and not at all well but at least I was in the right place). To get my mind off the needle I looked at an adult weighing machine. The units ON the machine were metric. There was a plastic coated sign on the wall immediately behind the scales which translated it to st/lb. Finally - we are members of an NCT group. Without fail the mothers all used floz when making up mixes or expressing. With the milk formula that's not surprising as the instructions on the side read downwards under the floz column as 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 with the millilitre figures next to it in hundreds. I have no doubt that official records record the metric weight however without fail all the people involved "spoke" imperial. Dilation would have been in 'cm' though - if it were not an emergency!! P.S. One for the books - the missus WHILST IN LABOUR AND HAVING CONTRACTIONS drove to the hospital filling up with fuel on the way. When I called her back at home from work surprised to find her still at home (considering she had called me saying she did not feel 'right') she said that she hadn't put make up on yet!! "Women" !!! From: [email protected] To: [email protected] Subject: [USMA:46741] Re: metric products UK Date: Tue, 23 Feb 2010 21:40:14 +0000 A small note about scales used for measuring people in the UK. Scales that are destined for domestic use have invariably been dual-unit since the 1970’s. However since a report last year that criticized certain hospitals for using domestic quality scales that had not been properly maintained was published, it has become mandatory for the medical profession to use professional-quality scales (which are regularly recalibrated) and which show kilograms only. Official medical records are kept in metric units, though a baby’s birth-weight might be communicated to the parents in either units. Steve Humphries is more up-to-date than me on that – he became a father in the last year or two. The weights of my children (born 1980’s) was certainly communicated to me in metric units – 3.50 kg and 4.05 kg. I do not recall the imperial equivalents nor do I recall having been given them. From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Stephen Davis Sent: 23 February 2010 20:25 To: U.S. Metric Association Subject: [USMA:46739] Re: metric products UK The vast majority of things in the UK are fully metric, John. The only time you will really see mixed units is with loose goods like fruit and veg on market stalls. The metric measurement must be more pronounced than the imperial measurement. This is largely academic since these items must be weighed on fully metric scales anyway. Pints of beer, of course, are the only real fully imperial item in the UK. Scales that measure people (in stones: 14 pounds) will probably mentioned by some, but the majority of recent ones also weigh in kilograms as well. ----- Original Message ----- From: John Frewen-Lord To: U.S. Metric Association Sent: Tuesday, February 23, 2010 2:47 PM Subject: [USMA:46734] metric products UK To all those who say that the UK is not really metric: I was researching the town of Axminster on Google, and came across this website regarding hydraulic bricquette presses. All specs as far as I can see are in metric units. http://www.axminster.co.uk/product-Rojek-BrikStar-50-Hydraulic-Briquette-Press-582182.htm John F-L Do you want a Hotmail account? Sign-up now - Free Do you want a Hotmail account? Sign-up now - Free _________________________________________________________________ Tell us your greatest, weirdest and funniest Hotmail stories http://clk.atdmt.com/UKM/go/195013117/direct/01/
