Dear Anthony,
I disagree with your statement:
If you as a customer did not get the full 570 mL, then it is your own
fault if you did not ask.
When I go to a pub in England I do so to spend a pleasant evening with
my friends. I do not go to the pub with the idea of fighting innocent
bar staff about a corrupted measuring method that is not in the
control of the publican or their staff. Secondly, I like to have a
'head' on top of my beer. It is my custom to estimate the volume of
this froth and from my estimates in England the froth is usually about
70 millilitres, leaving me with about 500 millilitres of actual liquid
beer. (I have not been aware, nor have I observed, the 'practice of
defining a pint of beer and lager as only 95 per cent liquid.')
These two considerations force me into a position where – sadly and
somewhat begrudgingly – I go along with the stupid status quo that
exists in all the English pubs that I have visited.
By the way, the word pint derives from the Latin pincta that means
paint. Pincta referred in Roman times to the paint mark on the side of
the beer mug that indicated the level of the liquid beer inside;
presumably the Roman soldiers checked this with their finger inside
the mug. This mark on the outside of the glass is required by law in
Germany where the mark is often at the 500 mL liquid level.
Cheers,
Pat Naughtin
Author of the ebook, Metrication Leaders Guide, see
http://metricationmatters.com/MetricationLeadersGuideInfo.html
Hear Pat speak at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lshRAPvPZY
PO Box 305 Belmont 3216,
Geelong, Australia
Phone: 61 3 5241 2008
Metric system consultant, writer, and speaker, Pat Naughtin, has
helped thousands of people and hundreds of companies upgrade to the
modern metric system smoothly, quickly, and so economically that they
now save thousands each year when buying, processing, or selling for
their businesses. Pat provides services and resources for many
different trades, crafts, and professions for commercial, industrial
and government metrication leaders in Asia, Europe, and in the USA.
Pat's clients include the Australian Government, Google, NASA, NIST,
and the metric associations of Canada, the UK, and the USA. See http://www.metricationmatters.com
for more metrication information, contact Pat at [email protected]
or to get the free 'Metrication matters' newsletter go to: http://www.metricationmatters.com/newsletter
to subscribe.
On 2010/07/09, at 23:47 , Anthony O'conner wrote:
Pat,
This may not be entirely true. From Wikipedia:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pint_glass
Despite this emphasis on accurately measured glasses, there is a
practice of defining a pint of beer and lager as only 95 per cent
liquid.[5] It is common for drinkers to be served less than a full
pint of liquid[6] — either because too much of the glass is taken up
by a foamy "head", or simply because the customer has been sold a
short measure. This allows publicans to sell more pints of beer than
the stated capacity of the cask or keg and hence save money. This
practice may have consciously increased since the removal of a duty
allowance on Ullage (wastage). To counter this the British Beer and
Pub Association have issued guidelines for bar staff to respect a
customer who asks for a 'top up' to a full pint.[7]
If you take a pint glass as holding 570 mL, then 95 % of 570 is
about 540 mL. If someone only received 500 mL (may be some pubs do
only give that amount - short measure) that would be really
cheating. As noted though, each patron has the right to ask for a
top up and the pub has to oblige. If you as a customer did not get
the full 570 mL, then it is your own fault if you did not ask.
I also find it interesting that pint glasses aren't really true
pints. A UK pint is 568 mL, but the glasses are designed for 570 mL
and are advertised as such. This may have something to do with pint
glasses now being made in metric countries. Just like the Chinese
producing wood products in 1220 mm x 2440 mm instead of 1219.2 x
2438.4, glass makers in metric countries will produce to a rounded
metric value, usually to the nearest 5 or 10 mm or mL. Whereas anti-
metric types harp on precise non-metric equivalents, the people in
metric countries have no problem producing the product to a rounded
metric amount.
http://www.polysafe.com.au/570mL%20Pint%20Glass.html
http://beerpintglass.com/1-x-570ml-1-pint-tooheys-new-etched-glass-beer-stein/
Now it would be interesting to find out if the stamped pint mark is
placed at 568 mL or 570 mL on the glass or is the difference covered
up in the tolerance?
From: Pat Naughtin <[email protected]>
To: U.S. Metric Association <[email protected]>
Cc: U.S. Metric Association <[email protected]>
Sent: Thu, July 8, 2010 11:03:31 PM
Subject: [USMA:48119] When is a nation metric?
On 2010/07/09, at 02:36 , [email protected] wrote:
In other words, how fully metric a country is, from completely
metric with no old units ever used by anyone, to essentially old
units only with only a bit of metric used. The indication would be
useful if it sensed what the average person does and says in
conversation, as it is assumed that scientists and others behind
the scenes use metric. In that regard the USA would be quite to
one side.
Carleton
Dear Carleton and All,
It seems to me that all attempts at development of measuring methods
have always contained a large drive toward honesty. Examples include
all of the Biblical references to measurement, the Magna Carta, John
Wilkins 'univeral measure' that became the metric system, Thomas
Jefferson's decimal measures report to Congress in 1790, the French
'decimal metric system' of 1790 (later than Jefferson), and the
CGPM International System of Units (SI) in 1960. See http://www.metricationmatters.com/docs/MetricationTimeline.pdf
and search for any of the above words.
And, at the same time as these moves toward honesty were taking
place, there were also resistance to any better measuring methods by
those who, for whatever reasons, favored or support dishonesty.
Examples include 'pints' of beer in the UK served in portions of 500
millilitres with a head of froth to fit into a nominal pint glass if
filled to the brim, oil purportedly measured in 'barrels' that never
existed to make it difficult to compare crude oil prices to be
compared with pump prices, shoe sizes, bra sizes, clothing sizes of
all kinds, etc. etc. etc. etc.
Overall there are people who support honesty who also support the
metric system.
And there are those who support dishonesty!
I suppose that a nation is truly metric when all transactions are
transparently honest.
Cheers,
Pat Naughtin
Author of the ebook, Metrication Leaders Guide,
seehttp://metricationmatters.com/MetricationLeadersGuideInfo.html
Hear Pat speak at: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_lshRAPvPZY
PO Box 305 Belmont 3216,
Geelong, Australia
Phone: 61 3 5241 2008
Metric system consultant, writer, and speaker, Pat Naughtin, has
helped thousands of people and hundreds of companies upgrade to the
modern metric system smoothly, quickly, and so economically that
they now save thousands each year when buying, processing, or
selling for their businesses. Pat provides services and resources
for many different trades, crafts, and professions for commercial,
industrial and government metrication leaders in Asia, Europe, and
in the USA. Pat's clients include the Australian Government, Google,
NASA, NIST, and the metric associations of Canada, the UK, and the
USA. See http://www.metricationmatters.com/ or to get the free
'Metrication matters' newsletter go to: http://www.metricationmatters.com/newsletter
to subscribe.
