Hey Phil,
did you get the message I sent you about the tuning info on the Keihin
Carbs? I just wanted to know if it helped?
Talk to you.
Michael Jones
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Indianapolis, IN
1985 V-Max
GSX1300R
V.M.O.A #61
Midwest Director (Great Lakes: IN, OH, IL, MI, WI)
Day Time E-Mail [EMAIL PROTECTED]
----- Original Message -----
From: "Phil" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "V-MAX TECH LIST" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Wednesday, June 14, 2000 10:12 PM
Subject: Re: attention flatside carb owners LONG Post!!
> Ok Didn't want to bore the list but will post some of what I found out.
>
> As many of you know I am having a rich running problem with my long rod.
> I ran last week and one pass would be 129MPH and then the next was
> 126MPH. I would yank my plugs and I found out that I was fouling the
> plugs pretty bad. I had been experiencing with the mains and I was
> getting it to foul less but still fouling pretty bad. When I took it to
> be dynoed it came in at 172Hp corrected and that is what my friends was
> at so I knew it couldn't be right. The perf shop told me the dyno was
> telling me my bike was running fine. This makes sense as I found out
> that they Dyno doesn't correctly interpret the mixture on flatsides cuz
> it only works at wide open throttle. My mains were ok at wide open
> throttle BUT my plugs were fouled when I had the dyno done. therefore my
> HP WAS around 172 but my bike was not running properly at the low end.
> So when I'm at the track and I run down with a fresh set of plugs my hp
> was higher than what it had been dynoed at.
> I called PCW and they started the troubleshooting process with me. Why
> were my plugs fouling ? I could go on about the mistakes I made in the
> last week but there were too many so I will talk about the way these
> things should be tuned. First an overview of what is tunable on these
> carbs and some history.
>
> I never realized where these carbs come from, They are the flatside
> carbs from Keihin that PCW MODIFYS. I always thought that PCW just
> acquired them from Keihin as is and did some minor mods to make them
> work on their big bores. They are the inline carbs and PCW modifys(cuts
> them into individual carbs) and then fits them to the motor and puts on
> brackets etc...... First eye opener for me !
>
> Tuning
> The carbs I thought had three adjustments to them Idle mixture, needles
> and mains. With the order of throttle being 0-1/4, 1/4 to 3/4 and WOT
> (wide open throttle respectively). I have been trying to launch this
> bike and in order to get my bike to run have been whacking the throttle
> too much. I was doing this because the bike just wasn't running to well
> from 0 -1/2 throttle. Well that is killing my 0-60ft times. I had better
> times on my stock vmax 0-60 at this altitude. Well, there is also a slow
> speed circuit which has two adjustments to it. The slow speed jet(SSJ)
> and the slow speed air jet(SSAJ). The SSJ and the SSAJ are what controls
> my 0-1/4 throttle. Let me give you some symptoms on my 0-1/2 throttle
> problems.
>
> Problems
> When I started my bike when it was cold it would start right up.Then
> after it was running normal temp and I shut it off the bike would barely
> start......Analysis, RICH RUNNING low end.
>
> When I launch my bike it would bog a little and then at 1/2 throttle it
> would take off like a bat out of hell ......Analysis RICH RUNNING LOW
> end.
>
> My bike was quieter than my friends 1428 long rod
> (noticably)....Analysis RICH RUNNING low end.
>
> Finally When I turned my fuel mixture screws all the way in to max rich,
> The bike would stay running just fine.....Analysis RICH RUNNING low end.
>
> These are classic symptoms of the low end being way out of whack. I
> talked for about an hour with a guy named Paul Morgan at Sudco
> (distributor) and he detailed what to do to fix these classic symptoms
> of the flatsides. One other note the Mechanical activation of these
> carbs dictates to ROLL the throttle PERIOD. IF you whack the throttle a
> bunch of fuel runs into your cylinders and doesn't burn properly. A
> habit very hard to break with my background running stock carbs. Keep in
> mind the stockers are vacuum advanced such that the fuel is regulated
> with the engine speed.
>
> Back to tuning.
>
> The SSJ circuit is a jet by the velocity stack and the jets are changed
> out with smaller ones for rich running circuits. You use a smaller jet
> to run leaner as they work with the fuel.
> The SSAJ circuit can be one of TWO types. Either a needle type OR a jet
> type. He thinks that I probably have the needle type in my carbs and
> that they are adjusted all the way in. The jet type regulates air flow
> and you turn those all the way in. The needle type is adjusted 1 and 1/2
> turns to get them set appropriately.
>
> The needles are like stock carbs and are adjusted with clips closer to
> the point makes them richer (pulls the needle in more) further out makes
> them leaner and pulls the needle out more which gives more air to the
> mixture.
>
> The mains for wot are jets and smaller numbers give you less fuel and
> bigger numbers give you more fuel.
>
> I took my bike home tonite and I am convinced that my slow circuit is
> all screwed up. On the way home I started really feeling the throttle
> and its response. When I am at 0-1/2 throttle my bike is not pulling
> very hard and it seems to like bog. When I get to 1/2 throttle and roll
> the throttle to WOT it just frigging screams. I am going to dive deep
> into this low speed circuit and get this worked out......
>
> I can't wait. I hope this helps and will update the list with what else
> I find out about this. Some of you guys probably knew this but it was
> totally eye opening to me.
>
> Take care Colo Phil
>
> Dennis Clarke wrote:
> >
> > Phil,
> >
> > why not post for all to read ?
> >
> > Dennis
> >
> > I found out some interesting things about the flatside carburetors. For
> > those of you that this is of note to give me an email and I'll fill you
> > in on the tuning tips that I got from a company today. Absolutely Eye
> > opening !!
> >
> > Take care Phil
> >
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