Very well said Matt.
I think that of all the open source Mail Code out , the combination of
qmail+vpopmail+qmailadmin+sqwebmail is the best of all. REALLY.
Don't let kids or grown ups that like to behave like kids spoil your
efforts or the things you believe in. Besides who are they to
critizice when they haven't taken the time to publish code that is open
to be critizicism and be able to correct their mistakes. They don't
know or don't realize how wrong they are.
Regards,
Leo.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Matt Simerson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Thursday, December 7, 2000 11:48 am
Subject: Don't sweat the small stuff.
> Ken (et al),
>
> First, and foremost, why do you care what the script kiddies on
> #openbsd say
> about your code? Seriously. Most of the people that loiter around
> on irc
> channels are either extremely competent people who have gravy jobs
> and can
> sit around and talk about all the cool stuff they've done. These
> are the 1
> to 2 people on the channel that really know their stuff and then
> you have
> the their throng of wanna be's soaking up the gospel from their
> cult hero or
> two. You can try all you want but you aren't going to change them.
> In time
> they'll begin to mature and begin the process of learning just how
> much they
> don't know.
>
> If that's not enough, you pick the openbsd channel where (not
> unlike that of
> most openbsd users) opinions of "code quality" is about as anal
> rententiveas you'll find on the planet. I'm not in favor of
> Microsoft style code
> quality but there is a point of dimishing returns. I ofter throw
> thingstogether "quick and dirty" because it doesn't matter if it's
> not done the
> best way. When I write a script that I run one time, I spend 5 minutes
> writing it (instead of 15) because it doesn't matter if it takes a
> minute to
> execute versus 10 seconds.
>
> You also need to remember that the overwhelming majority of people
> on IRC
> are kids. Literally, a bunch of little computer weenies running
> around with
> soggy ears and diapers. Not unlike most teenagers, they know
> everything and
> are more than willing to tell you all about it. Let them ramble
> on. What
> they say is almost assuredly out of ignorance and in time, they
> too will see
> the folly in their ways.
>
> If you want to measure the success of your project, ask people
> that use the
> software. Talk to guys like me, I'll tell you all about it. I've
> build more
> mail servers than there are script kiddies on that channel. I've
> used nearly
> everything MTA, MDA, and MUA that exists. I'm sure that within
> your ranks,
> I'm not the only very good, very smart, and highly clued systems
> architect/engineesome productive feedback.
>
> Vpopmail users have a vested interest in the code. Some of us
> appreciatethat it's open source. I've gone through quite a bit of
> effort to help
> document it. Have you seen my FreeBSD + Qmail + Vpopmail HOWTO?
> Take a look
> at it: http://matt.simerson.net/computing/qmail.toaster.shtml. Put
> a link to
> it on the vpopmail page. It's an excellent HOWTO and I know
> several guys
> have already built mail servers based on those instructions.
> That's a
> testimony to code quality.
>
> Even if it doesn't meet the yardstick of a bunch of script
> kiddies, the
> software does the job it's intended it to do. When bugs creep out
> we post
> them to the list. So far every issue I've had has been addressed.
> Grantedsometimes I have to wait a week or two but that's nothing
> compared to the
> length of time I've waited for some other software companies to
> fix their
> bugs. That testifies that at some levels, the open source project is
> working.
>
> Last, pulling the source code is the last thing you should ever
> do. Either
> you release it or you don't. If you don't then you're pissing on
> us, your
> users, and those that have contributed time to making the software
> betterwithout collecting a paycheck for doing so. You are
> punishing the wrong
> people. We're on your team and deserve better treatment than that.
>
> Matt
>
> On Thu, 7 Dec 2000, Ken Jones wrote:
>
> > I'm sorry.
> >
> > The source code will be put back on the site within the next
> > 24 hours. I apologize for the temporary lack of availablilty.
> >
> > Unfortunatly, i was conversing with people on #efnet on the
> > openbsd channel, and they insulted me deeply. I can not
> > begin to describe how deeply I was offeneded. It was not
> > one thing or another thing, just the small attitudes of
> > a small group of people.
> >
> > I would suggested you joing irc.east.gblx.net and go to
> > the #openbsd channel and say at least something.
> >
> > The code will be put back up on the site soon. Better
> > than ever. We are dedicated to providing open source
> > software to the internet.
> >
> > It's just, some times, I get really ticked off when
> > stupid kids tell me how bad my code is. And I know
> > they don't understand. Sorry.
> >
> > If you really want to make a difference, do something
> > to change something. I'm put the source back up in the
> > next few days. It just makes me sad. It will be available.
> >
> > If you really need it.. just email me and i"ll send you the
> > latest version.
> >
> > Ken Jones
>
>
