On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 02:37:27PM +0000, Filippov Alexey wrote: > Dear Benjamin, all, > > Thank you a lot for commenting our draft. > > > I support Roman's Discuss. > Got it and try to answer the raised question as soon as possible. > > > I am sympathetic to the tsv-art reviewer's concerns that this document is > > focused on video technology of 5 years ago and may lack relevant in the > > current world. > I'd like to comment the tsv-art reviewer's concerns. According to my > understanding, the review is focused on the fact that support for quality and > resolution scalability is not mandatory. These types of scalability are > important but usually some price in terms of compression performance should > be paid for their support. So, if it is efficiently implemented in a > candidate codec (i.e. "with compression efficiency penalty up to 5% of > BD-rate increase per layer" as pointed out in Section 3.3.2), they will be in > the main profile. Otherwise, " a separate profile is needed ...". In my > opinion, supporting for quality and resolution scalability without taking > into account compression efficiency penalty may prevent successful adoption > of NETVC codec by industry. > > Another concern raised by the tsv-art reviewer is that support for screen > content coding tools is not explicitly mentioned. > I absolutely agree that absence of these tools will harm compression > performance of a candidate codec. So, if these tools are not used in a codec, > it can't be competitive as compared to other candidate codecs. It will become > apparent while testing it (by the way, the testing draft contains screen > content materials). On the other hand, we shouldn't insist on supporting for > specific screen content tools that would restrict the freedom of codec > developers. > > Please note that these and other concerns were addressed in my response: > https://mailarchive.ietf.org/arch/msg/tsv-art/RpypjqRJD_Njens-SYwdpRRQFU0
I did not your previous response, which is much appreciated. Unfortunately, this is far from my area of expertise, so my main goal here was to raise the question to the IESG at a whole, and having done that, I have changed my ballot position to No Objection. It would be great to hear more from Bernard when he has time, and I think Adam is going to work on getting that to happen. -Ben > > -----Original Message----- > From: Benjamin Kaduk via Datatracker [mailto:[email protected]] > Sent: Thursday, June 13, 2019 4:23 PM > To: The IESG <[email protected]> > Cc: [email protected]; Mo Zanaty <[email protected]>; > [email protected]; [email protected]; [email protected] > Subject: Benjamin Kaduk's Discuss on draft-ietf-netvc-requirements-09: (with > DISCUSS and COMMENT) > > Benjamin Kaduk has entered the following ballot position for > draft-ietf-netvc-requirements-09: Discuss > > When responding, please keep the subject line intact and reply to all email > addresses included in the To and CC lines. (Feel free to cut this > introductory paragraph, however.) > > > Please refer to https://www.ietf.org/iesg/statement/discuss-criteria.html > for more information about IESG DISCUSS and COMMENT positions. > > > The document, along with other ballot positions, can be found here: > https://datatracker.ietf.org/doc/draft-ietf-netvc-requirements/ > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > DISCUSS: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > I support Roman's Discuss. > > I am sympathetic to the tsv-art reviewer's concerns that this document is > focused on video technology of 5 years ago and may lack relevant in the > current world. I don't intend to hold a Discuss point for any specific > resolution, but I do think the IESG should discuss whether this concern > affects the value of publishing this document as an RFC. > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > COMMENT: > ---------------------------------------------------------------------- > > Section 2.1 > > What do "PAM" and "RA" mean? Moving Appendix A earlier (before Section > 2) or referring to it from the Introduction would be helpful. Note that RFC > style is to expand on first use... > > . High Dynamic Range (HDR), Wide Color Gamut (WCG), high > resolution (currently, up to 4K), high frame-rate content are > important use cases, the codec should be able to encode such > content efficiently. > > nits: missing "and" in serial list, and the last comma is a comma splice. > > Section 2.5 > > [Google didn't help me find reference [9].] > > Section 2.6 > > The (long) list in Section 2.5 includes "cloud gaming"; how much overlap does > that have with this service? > > Section 3.1, 3.2 > > What is the difference between "General Requirements" and "Basic > Requirements"? > > ection 3.2.1 > > Is "Exemplary input source formats" supposed to just be an example, or an > indication of the pinnacle of possible values? > > Section 4.1 > > Initially, for the codec selected as a reference one (e.g., HEVC or > VP9), a set of 10 QP (quantization parameter) values should be > specified (in a separate document on Internet video codec testing) > and corresponding quality values should be calculated. [...] > > This seems to suggest ("Initially", "for the codec selected") that the > evaulation requirements are not yet complete. Are they intended to be a > single set of requirements for the codec's development, or customized to some > per-application requirements? (Is there a reference needed to ongoing work > to solidify these requirements?) > > QP'k = argmin { abs(Q'i(QP'i) - Qk(QPk)) }, > i in R > > I would suggest defining the argmin function. > > It's surprising to see no reference to draft-ietf-netvc-testing from this > document. > > Section 6 > > I don't see much need for a "Conclusions" section of this nature, in this > document. > > Appendix B > > Defining (e.g.) "high dynamic range" and "wide color gamut" with respect to > "normal" or "conventional" mechanisms does not really provide a stable and > archival reference for comparison. > > _______________________________________________ video-codec mailing list [email protected] https://www.ietf.org/mailman/listinfo/video-codec
