If I understand him right, Jackson doesn't suggest that these dissonances were _never_ doubled in (solo) accompaniment to the solo voice. To me the examples he gives were a reason to reconsider present practices.
And indeed the example under discussion is from a solo piece. However, even if 3/4 clashes are quite common with some composers, it feels uncomfortable that this particular 3-4-3 cadence d#' - e' - d#' ( - e') seems never to appear with the open e' included in his book (if I am right). Neither in the continuo examples, nor in the solo's. And as a reply to Monica's last post: also I think that the open e' strings in these examples (Dean p. 263-4) are not clearly intended to ring on. I would not play it like that. Best wishes, Lex Van: Martyn Hodgson [mailto:hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk] Verzonden: woensdag 20 november 2013 9:43 Aan: Lex Eisenhardt; 'Monica Hall'; 'WALSH STUART' CC: 'Vihuelalist' Onderwerp: Re: [VIHUELA] Re: Matteis Thank you for this Lex. Of course here Jackson is speaking about continuo practice where the harmonic clash is already there in other vocal and/or instrumental lines. But in the Matteis example this is a guitar solo. Incidentally I'm not entirely convinced by Jackson's paper (and the slightly selective examples) that the practice of never doubling dissonances in the context was generally universally applied historically. regards Martyn _______________________________________________________________________ From: Lex Eisenhardt <eisenha...@planet.nl> To: 'Martyn Hodgson' <hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk>; 'Monica Hall' <mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk>; 'WALSH STUART' <s.wa...@ntlworld.com> Cc: 'Vihuelalist' <firstname.lastname@example.org> Sent: Tuesday, 19 November 2013, 16:51 Subject: [VIHUELA] Re: Matteis For an on-line article by Roland Jackson, about all sorts of harmonic clashes, follow the download link http://scholarship.claremont.edu/ppr/vol11/iss1/2/ Lex -----Oorspronkelijk bericht----- Van: lute-...@cs.dartmouth..edu [mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] Namens Martyn Hodgson Verzonden: zaterdag 16 november 2013 10:26 Aan: Monica Hall; WALSH STUART CC: Vihuelalist Onderwerp: [VIHUELA] Re: Matteis Dear Monica, This is all a question of context; mostly to do with expected cadential effects and the prevailing tonality of the melodic line. 1. For example a dissonance of seconds at a cadence was a common practice at the time; both in orchestral writing as well as on the guitar etc. The effect even has a modern name: the 'Corelli clash' after his frequent use of it. Typically this occurs at a cadence where the (sharp) third of the dominant (the sharpened leading note) is sounded concurrently with an anticipated tonic (so for a cadence ending with a G major chord an F# is sounded together with a G). It is, in my view, important to play this effect with 'boldness and conviction' to ensure auditors don't think it's a mistake! In short, it is by no means too exotic for the period as you suppose below ('Just talking about the last two bars of line three: playing the top and bottom courses open sounds quite rich and exotic! But perhaps far too rich for its surroundings'). So the B to Em cadence at the end of the third line on page 2 of the 1682 publication with a D# and E sounding concurrently is perfectly correct. I suppose you could throw in the open fifth course too (to give a 7th A) but this is not really in line with general practice at that time (use of sevenths at cadences became much more common in the 18th century). 2. However where there is no such cadential (or similar effect) context, contemporary auditors would not have expected such rude clashes interfering with the melodic line. So, for example on the same line and 4 bars from the end, the D chord on the second beat would not have the first course added (an open e' according to Matteis' guitar tuning) - Matteis either overlooked this or took it as read that a player would not need to be told. Similarly in the 'Aria' at the beginning of page 4 the player should not include non-melodic notes (such as an open e' on the first beat of the first full bar or the open b and e' on the first beat of the next bar). It simply requires careful control of the strum - perhaps some guitarists basing their early strumming technique on modern flamenco rasgueado may find this more difficult but, of course, it's no reason to believe the Old Ones were not technically capable/accomplished to achieve such refined playing. There's also a parallel with unwritten practice in continuo playing:- here sometimes a sixth cord is not figured at all - it being assumed that the player has sufficient knowledge of basic rules of harmony that in a particular key sequence such bass notes will generally need first inversion chords (unless otherwise indicated). regards, Martyn PS Incidentally, I find it easier to follow a discussion if the responder does not interweave their reply with the sender's text - but perhaps that's just me................ __________________________________________________________________ To get on or off this list see list information at http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------- Tekst ingevoegd door Panda IS 2013: Als het hier gaat om een ongevraagde e-mail (SPAM), klik dan op de volgende link om de e-mail te herclasseren: It is SPAM! ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ---------------------------- -- References 1. mailto:eisenha...@planet.nl 2. mailto:hodgsonmar...@yahoo.co.uk 3. mailto:mjlh...@tiscali.co.uk 4. mailto:s.wa...@ntlworld.com 5. mailto:email@example.com 6. http://scholarship.claremont.edu/ppr/vol11/iss1/2/ 7. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 8. mailto:lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu 9. http://www.cs.dartmouth.edu/~wbc/lute-admin/index.html 10. http://localhost:6083/Panda?ID=pav_1297&SPAM=true&path=C:\Windows\system32\config\systemprofile\AppData\Local\Panda%20Security\Panda%20Internet%20Security%202013\AntiSpam