The short answer is that the solar model/comparison at this stage is far more metaphorical than real.
The situation instantly changes from metaphorical to "ok let's take a closer look" if and when 3He turns up in the ash From: Mark Iverson Hi Jones, Can certainly understand trying to develop alternative hypotheses based on what "nature prefers to do", however, if I understand correctly, you are choosing a reaction process that is occurring in the sun? Many involved with LENR have argued with the skeptics that the "usual fusion physics" cannot be applied to LENR because those 'laws' only apply at extreme temperature and pressures? I guess this begs the question, "How does extreme temperatures and pressures affect the elements in your hypothetical process?" -Mark _____ From: Jones Beene The nuclear reactions involving Helium-3 are arguably the most important reactions in the universe - the sine qua non for the heat and light necessary for life. Yet Helium-3 has been seldom mentioned in LENR and all the prior emphasis has been towards converting deuterium directly to Helium-4, which is a reaction that is impossible even on our sun! Of course there are good reasons for the 'slight', but maybe it is time to go back to basics, so to speak. In short, the most common fusion chain in the universe - the three step pathway to convert hydrogen to helium-4, which is found in all Stars, involves 3He in two of the three stages. But since 3He is rare on earth, we have effectively ignored the possibilities of a substituted reaction based on this isotope. This may change, thanks in part to Ing Rossi, even if it turns out not to be what is happening in his device. The point being: why would we not look to 3He as a way to fuse hydrogen on earth, if there is found any logical way that it could happen? We already know that nature "prefers" to go this route, so why not copy nature as best we can? If the answer you give is that the conditions do not exist here - that may be a partially wrong answer. Miley has shown that IRH, or inverted Rydberg hydrogen can be made at the nanoscale and that IRH has the required density. Therefore what we should ask is: does another pathway exist to go from dense hydrogen to 3He without deuterium ? I think there is another way, and that is the purpose of this posting - to roughly describe it as going from the Efimov state (instead of a 3-body reaction) and to do it in the next step via the heavy or deflated electron. This then becomes a mash-up of a number of theories floating around, but it seems to work logically (so far) - and all that is needed to flesh it out more fully would be the discovery of 3He in the nuclear ash of the Rossi - OR - any other kind of Ni-H system where 'pycno' could be involved. The Rossi device may or may not include this pathway, and the inventor admits he does not know how it operates in theory, but it does use nano-nickel in a way that is (arguably) consistent with Efimov conversion of hydrogen into 3He. The beauty of it is that the pathway to 3He may be considerably easier to engineer, and cheaper than anything else out there. I will not repeat the details of Efimov hydrogen except to say that it consists of 3 bound atoms of hydrogen in the Borromean ring configuration. Wiki has an entry and here is a news article. <http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/12/091211131526.htm> http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2009/12/091211131526.htm The Efimov state involves trimers and bosons. Usually it require very low temperatures. That is where the QBEC comes in. The QBEC or quasi BEC, is a hypothetical transitory condensate, especially composed of the only unique "composite boson" in nature that might possibly condense in an oscillating fashion at high temperature - for a tiny instant of time in each cycle. This is atomic hydrogen or single H, which has the minimum of 2 fermions giving integer spin. Given that spin can be aligned magnetically across many atoms, the daunting task of aligning other properties is greatly diminished so that normal probability gives one a statistical "window" in which transitory condensation at moderate temperatures - way above absolute zero, may be seen. A third ingredient in the mash-up is the recent thread on heavy or deflated electrons. However, the first thing that comes to mind, if we invoke a heavy electron, is why not use it to justify P-e-P instead of invoking it for what looks like a 3-body reaction? My response is that yes, the P-e-P reaction is possible too, and what it really gets down to which one has the lowest threshold. (and what is discovered in the ash of relevant experiments). What I like about the Borromean ring of three atoms of hydrogen is that these things are stable on their own, neutral, and could be floating around in a metal matrix until such time as they encounter a heavy or deflated electron, which effectively converts one of the three protons to the neutron (in the "new" 3He nucleus), retaining two of the three normal electrons. The extra energy would be carried away by the odd-man-out electron. This pre-hypothesis obviously needs more thought, and it may collapse as soon as someone notices an obvious problem that I have missed. But hey - that is the value of newsgroups, no? . the sounding board for the outrageous suggestion that can become tomorrow's "told-you-so". Jones
