On Fri, 20 Aug 2004, Keith Nagel wrote: > Hi Bill. > > You need to read the paper in question;
I did. It was the stuff about "miniscule piece of apparatus operating out of a backpack" that made me question the appropriateness of the HyperPhysics quote. I was thinking that you cannot just go and charge up some 120V circuitry to 10^12 volts with a simple backpack power supply. On the other hand, I'm probably misreading Shoulders' intent. I thought he was saying something like this: "physicists know that it's easy to achive billion-Newton forces; you just have to let a current run into a 120V circuit for a second" ...and then acting as if the HyperPhysics article backs him up. (No, it doesn't.) On the other hand, he PROBABLY meant that, since EVs apparently violate energy conservation, (they catalyze the extraction of ZPE), therefore it WOULD be possible to achive millions of tons force if the small backpack unit was triggering the formation of a 1cm diameter EV but without having to directly charge a 1pf capacitance to 10^12 volts (which, by 1/2cv^2, would require that the batteries provide 10^12 Joules of energy). Or in other words, hobbyists who experiment with EVs may achive success, and also achieve a 100ft crater in their neighborhoods, both at once. :) Also Ken said this: One of the most fundamental questions about EVO use is how far does the charge masking effect go toward complete elimination of externally expressed charge. The containment of charge is seemingly at the root of the question but there is not yet an answer as to the extent of the effect for properly trapped and cooled electrons. Isn't "Complete elimination" another way of saying "apparent violation of charge conservation at the macro level?" I recall that even an extremely small violation of charge conservation is fairly easy to measure with a "Faraday Ice-pail" setup. Put your experiment in a floating metal shield box, and suspend it inside a larger shield box. Then measure the DC voltage between the two boxes. If the capacitance between them is around 10pF, and the DC voltage suddenly jumps by 1 microvolt, then you know that you've suddenly created 10^-17 coulombs of charge (about 600 electrons worth.) But if the "masking" effect is caused by an attractive force rather than by a violation of charge conservation, the force might not extend much farther than the distance between atoms in a solid (the distance between electrons in Shoulders' "EV" clusters.) (((((((((((((((((( ( ( ( ( (O) ) ) ) ) ))))))))))))))))))) William J. Beaty SCIENCE HOBBYIST website [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://amasci.com EE/programmer/sci-exhibits amateur science, hobby projects, sci fair Seattle, WA 206-789-0775 unusual phenomena, tesla coils, weird sci
