Thanks, we've got em On Thursday, December 27, 2012, David Roberson wrote:
> For this particular thread we were concentrating upon very large black > holes. You can have the tiny ones. > > Dave > > > -----Original Message----- > From: ChemE Stewart <[email protected] <javascript:_e({}, 'cvml', > '[email protected]');>> > To: vortex-l <[email protected]> > Sent: Thu, Dec 27, 2012 8:34 pm > Subject: Re: [Vo]:[OT]:Question About Event Horizon > > Guys, > > Not all black holes are cold, the "small" ones are extremely hot. > Unless you only believe in large ones... > > A black hole weighing 1.2x10e12 kg is about a million K with a radius of > 1.8x10e-10 meters. If the sun spit that at earth it might orbit around a > few months and collapse atmospheric gasses around it and create a > hurricane... > > http://xaonon.dyndns.org/hawking/ > > > On Thursday, December 27, 2012, David Roberson wrote: > > Notice that I carefully specified that the photon left from a point that > is extremely close to but outside of the horizon. There is no problem with > this location as far as the radial outward path of a photon. If I had said > what you suggest the it started within the horizon, then there is an issue. > So, the photon as before continues outward from this side of the horizon > toward the far away observers. I asked the question about where the energy > ends up because I suspect that it becomes distributed throughout space in > some manner. One might draw a conclusion that space is stretched out from > the horizon due to some form of linear dimension dilation so that the COE > is preserved. This is not completely evident and I do not know if it is > assumed in any theory except possibly for the curvature of space associated > with general relativity. > > It becomes increasingly complicated if we must deal with dilation of > both space and time. My photon thought experiment tends to support that > supposition. If one follows the logic in reverse the spaceman sees that > any thermal noise or other radiation incident upon the hole from the > outside would become very intense within this region near the boundary. > You would not want to visit this area for a vacation. > > Your question about the existence of black holes is a good one. There > have been measurements of the effect of one at the center of our galaxy on > nearby stars which is quite convincing. Some of the enormous beams of > energy being emitted by other galaxies in opposite directions from their > axis seem to have not other conceivable mechanisms so far. > > I have wondered about how matter is added to a black hole once it > reaches a point where time dilation becomes so great that we observe it > freezing on the way in. Like our test probe ship, this incoming matter > should be frozen in some manner until the radiation from it red shifts all > the way to zero. Of course that is what we observe at a distance which is > the key. > > Lets start with something simple. A large star that is not quite > massive enough to become an assumed black hole behaves in ways that we are > familiar. My statement begs an interesting question. How does a star > appear to a far away observer if it has a mass that is just below that > required for it to become a black hole? I would guess that the outer edge > of such a beast would exhibit enormous gravitational flux and the > associated time dilation. It really makes me wonder what happens to normal > radiation that is emitted from the surface. Should we assume that it > becomes red shifted as it travels our direction to a very large extent. > That energy leaving the massive star becomes trapped within the space > surrounding it to a significant degree; how is this possible unless space > itself has expanded to accommodate it? Does anyone on vortex know of the > observations of any stars that fall into this category? Perhaps they > appear like red giants at our location-interesting question. The obvious > solution is that they explode before this occurs. Is that their fate? > > Speculation can be fun to engage in, but I am not sure that it is > productive to keep alive a thread for this long unless other members of the > vortex become interested. It does not seem fair to them for us to borrow > most of the bandwidth for so long so I plan to return to the main topic > very soon. I have enjoyed our thought processes and it is relaxing after I > finally competed a good model for the MFMP cell behavior. > > Dave > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Abd ul-Rahman Lomax <[email protected]> > To: vortex-l <[email protected]>; vortex-l <vortex-l@esk > >
