jadi kesimpulannya : abah hmna setuju dengan luxenberg ?
kalo pak samsudin arief gimana ? setuju sama luxenberg dibagian 72 bidadari
diganti anggur putih itu ?


On Sat, Mar 13, 2010 at 10:54 PM, Wikan Danar Sunindyo <
wikan.da...@gmail.com> wrote:

> terima kasih pak nur atas kirimannya,
> saya sendiri kenal pribadi dengan Pak Syamsudin Arief waktu di Jerman
> dan kritisinya terhadap tulisan-tulisan Luxenberg
> mengenai bidadari di surga, justru Luxenberg ini menentang penafsiran
> "hur" sebagai bidadari di surga melainkan sebagai anggur putih
> jadi anggapan bahwa di surga orang muslim akan mendapatkan bidadari
> itu justru bukan tafsiran dari Luxenberg
> dan bukan Luxenberg yang salah mengutip bahwa orang muslim akan
> mendapatkan 72 bidadari karena keliru memaknai penomoran ayat, karena
> Luxenberg merujuk pada QS 44:54
> Virgins or grapes?
> The by now world-famous story about 'virgins or grapes' also works
> like this. Luxenberg starts with Q 44:54 ?? ????????????? ???????
> ????? wa zawwajnahum bi hur 'in, 'We shall wed them to maidens with
> large, dark eyes'. For ??????? zawwajnahum, 'we shall wed them' he has
> a different, and purely Arabic, alternative: ??????? rawwahnahum 'we
> shall let them rest'. It's a difference of only two diacritical dots
> and in rasm it's identical.[15] The interpretation now used by Muslims
> was a result of the preposition bi being read as Arabic 'to'. 'We
> shall let them rest to' doesn't sound as logical as 'We shall wed them
> to'. Hence the Arabic reading of bi. But in Syriac bi also means
> 'under' or 'among' and that makes the translation 'we shall let them
> rest among...' a very good possibility.
> If this reading is accepted, hur 'in cannot refer to virgins any more.
> Furthermore, the way in which hur 'in is traditionally translated
> requires some idiomatic acrobatics. Literally hur is a plural of the
> female adjective 'white' (????? hawra'). So it could refer to white
> women, but the object might just as well be a female word in the
> grammatical sense only. The word 'in is traditionally seen as the
> plural of the word for 'eye' and is translated by 'wide-eyed'. It is
> however not a usual plural and it only occurs in the phrase hur 'in.
> So in a sense it is a hapax. The literal translation 'wide-eyed
> whites' would then be a description of the virgins in paradise. In
> English translations this rather too literal choice of words is
> rendered as 'fair ones with wide, lovely eyes' (Pickthal), 'fair women
> with beautiful, big and lustrous eyes' (Yusufali) and even just
> 'Houris pure, beautiful ones' (Shakir).
> Luxenberg doesn't deny that hur can mean 'white' and 'in 'eye', but he
> proposes, through Syriac, a different reading of bi hur 'in as a
> consequence of the changed context: 'among/under fine/crystal clear
> whites'. That cryptic phrase works more or less in the same way that
> 'big cheese' can describe an important person in English. Luxenberg
> finds parallels for the metonymic use of the word 'white' in the sense
> of 'grape', both in Arabic and in Syriac. The 'eye' in his view is a
> metaphor to describe 'the appearance' of something. For this too he
> manages to find expressions in both languages, like 'the "eye" of a
> man' meaning 'his appearance' and 'the "eye" of something' in the
> sense of 'its preciousness'.[16]
> salam,
> --
> wikan
> On Sat, Mar 13, 2010 at 3:27 PM, H. M. Nur Abdurahman
> <mnur.abdurrah...@yahoo.co.id <mnur.abdurrahman%40yahoo.co.id>> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Wikan Danar Sunindyo" <wikan.da...@gmail.com<wikan.danar%40gmail.com>
> >
> > To: <wanita-muslimah@yahoogroups.com <wanita-muslimah%40yahoogroups.com>
> >
> > Sent: Saturday, March 13, 2010 12:31
> > Subject: Re: [wanita-muslimah] Misteri Sungai di Dalam Laut Mexico
> >
> > saya malah gak nemu bagian mana dari situs answering islam yang memuat
> > tulisan luxenberg
> > mungkin pak nur bisa menunjukkan?
> > karena situs answering islam http://www.answering-islam.org itu
> > mengandung banyak tulisan, berlevel-level, tidak ada fasilitas search
> > serta nyambung ke situs-situs lain dalam berbagai bahasa
> > saya pengin tahu saja tulisan luxenberg dalam situs tersebut seperti apa
> > terima kasih
> > ##########################################################
> > HMNA:
> > Mengenai tulisan Luxenberg tidak dari Answering Islam saja. Itupun kalau
> berasal dari Answering Ilam berupa kutipan dari pion-pion situs tsb.seperti
> misalnya antara lain dari Gabriela K. Kalau berminat tahu Luxenberg dan
> tulisannya, ini saya tampilkan:

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]


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