On 25/10/2017 19:05, Maciej Stachowiak wrote: > > (1) Is it at all common to use MathML with a math font specified as a web > font? Can you give an example? I can't say whether it is "common" but I guess the trick is well known by MathML users, since unfortunately many systems do not provide math fonts by default. I have a github repo with known fonts at https://github.com/fred-wang/MathFonts

As an example Jacques Distler uses STIX 2 WOFF on his blog: https://golem.ph.utexas.edu/~distler/blog/archives/002702.html https://golem.ph.utexas.edu/~distler/blog/styles-site.css Some people also bundle WOFF fonts in web apps or ebooks. Web fonts are also used by browser addons e.g. https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/mathml-fonts/ which allow to workaround the lack of system fonts (and the impossibility to install them for users). Website using MathML often have a page with installation instructions for math fonts, for example on NIST dlmf: http://dlmf.nist.gov/help/mathml#S3 Note that I've seen similar things (WOFF fonts, addons, instructions) for other languages in the past e.g. https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/khmer-fonts-package/, so again it's not specific to math. > (2) Is it at all common to use MathML only to the extent that it's rendered > fine without a math font? Again, I'm not sure how common it is but I've seen some users happy with basic MathML rendering for elementary calculations. I was also surprised to see some people excited about my CSS stylesheet at https://github.com/fred-wang/mathml.css that can render very basic math. There are a lot of such formulas on Wikipedia, for sure for instance https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraction_(mathematics) contains MathML formulas that can be rendered without specialized math fonts. > (3) In the cases above, is there usually an image fallback? It really depends on the website. But definitely people using MathML need some fallback (image, CSS layout, javascript layout, text etc). How this fallback is triggered depends on the website, there is not any real rule. IIUC, the argument mentioned earlier only considers the case where an author would try to detect MathML support and automatically fallback to an image otherwise. As I said, authors could also try to detect availability of math fonts, or provide WOFF fallback (Distler's blog), or have a page to explain how to install fonts (e.g. NIST dlmf), or use image by default and explain how to enable MathML & install fonts (e.g. Wikipedia), or provide LaTeX fallback in an <annotation> (my blog) or... IMHO, platform owners should not speculate on what authors will do. Disabling MathML just because of the lack of math fonts, does not seem a good idea. On the one hand, if MathML is enabled page authors can still decide to serve fallback content if they think the support is not good enough on the user platform. On the other hand, if the platform owner has disabled MathML, then there is no way for users/authors willing to use MathML to force it to be enabled again... > Why don't we wait to hear from port owners whether they would actually want > to disable MathML for reason of compatibiltiy. Knowing answers to the above > questions would help. Sure. My email was to follow-up on https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=177744 and the discussions at the Web Engines Hackfest, so they are not forgotten. But there is no hurry to remove the build flag for now. -- Frédéric Wang - frederic-wang.fr

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