Thorough, modestly priced and current educational information would be incredibly helpful. I don't know what self-paced computer instruction materials go for, but I'm thinking something in the $200 to $500 American dollars range would be a every good thing. P&L Systems seems to be the only option for WO training. Looking at their site, the fee for a 5 week class is £1695, which comes out to about $2655 in American dollars at today's exchange rate. Add in travel and lodging for anyone not living nearby (anyone outside the UK for sure), and WO training becomes a very serious commitment at best, and unreachable for most. I'm sure the training is fantastic and all. WOWODC requires travel, lodging etc. as well.
I have no idea if P&L Systems would be interested in diluting their in-house training opportunities by offering online coursework at a lower cost. How much does a WO programmer, expert enough to do the training, command in salary? Let's assume half the course fee goes to paying the salary of the instructor and other overhead. Would it make financial sense for P&L to offer the material at a much lower cost, if they could make it up in volume? Yeah, I know. Most of you probably just spat your Ovaltine all over your keyboards at the mention of "volume". On Mar 15, 2012, at 4:11 PM, Pascal Robert wrote: > I think the man who could do that is Paul Lynch, one of the few that is still > giving the Apple course (and the one who is doing the Boot Camp this summer). > I can ask him about recording the Boot Camp and selling it. > > As for certification, I don't think it's needed. Places that requires > certification are places that will ask for Java or Microsoft certified > people, not WebObjects (or Python or Rails). > >> I'm in pro of a curriculum and certification, a certification will give more >> seriousness to the community and to ourselves as programmers and it will >> help new developers giving them an structured way to learn about the huge >> compound of knowledge that is webobjects as it could be divided on levels or >> areas. >> I dont remember the way to say this in English, but there could be online >> courses every year to help us catch up with the new frameworks, so we could >> keep up to date with the wocommunity programming tendencies even after >> certification. >> >> and Online bootcamps would be cool to for the people that cant travel to >> other countries to the wowodc. >> >> Emmanuel~ >> >> >> >> On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 1:23 PM, Pascal Robert <[email protected]> wrote: >> As for priorities before WOWODC: >> >> - Registering the non-profit >> >> - Reworking wocommunity.org to be one app (REST based) with a new look and >> the name change (WOCommunity instead of WebObjects Community). I already >> started redoing the code and navigation: >> >> http://wocommunity.org/apps/WebObjects/WOCommunityRest.woa/ra/index.html >> >> And I have two people working on two different looks (and logos). >> >> - Finishing the tutorials that I started >> >> http://wiki.wocommunity.org/display/WONDER/Getting+Started >> >> - Have one set of instructions on how to install the tools so that newbies >> don't go away because of a bad experience with the installation >> >> - Have a presentation ready for iOS developers to explain why WO is good for >> them >> >> All of this so that we can try to have newbies at the Boot Camp just before >> WOWODC. >> >>> I think this discussion is very timely. Just a week ago I sent an email to >>> Pascal seeking his help to try to come up with ideas to improve upon what >>> we already have in the WO community. An excerpt of my email went like this: >>> >>> "My proposal is first based on setting up a non-profit educational >>> foundation. This foundation will then be able to receive tax-deductible >>> donations and contributions, etc. We should also actively pursue donations >>> from major corporations. We should then dedicate some time and talent to >>> write manuals and material for new developers. We should also consider >>> setting up a scholarship fund to encourage learning WO. We should also >>> encourage employers to hire "interns" as part of their training. An >>> affiliation with a college or university would be tremendously powerful. >>> And a certification would come handy at some point too. I have made initial >>> contacts with some individuals of which I think the first few elements of >>> this campaign would be doable. For example we don't need to set up our own >>> non-profit (too costly), but we can piggyback on someone else's. We have >>> also begun putting together a WO starter manual. This manual describes >>> every step of getting started from absolute scratch. I would like more >>> content to be added in the future by others in the community. We can easily >>> publish this book on the iBook store and the proceeds could go towards the >>> non-profit foundation. I also have someone in mind that could write the >>> teaching curriculum. More work would be needed of course to structure the >>> existing material and to have it peer reviewed. I wholeheartedly believe >>> that we need to rally everyone to selflessly commit to the WO community in >>> order save it." >>> >>> To summarize and also expand on some of your earlier comments: >>> >>> 1- Restructure the wocommunity.org to be a by-membership organization. We >>> should elect a board and a president (probably every 2 years). Changing >>> leadership would inject new ideas and new initiatives every once in a >>> while. The board should remain as a stable entity and where it will have >>> alternate elections. In other words, not all seats will be up at once. >>> 2- Set up a separate non-profit organization ASAP. Like I mentioned >>> earlier, we can piggyback on another organization for the time being and >>> until we can get our own. I think getting a non-profit approved by the IRS >>> is a timely process and will require that we know what we're doing. I think >>> it would be best to piggyback at first. I know of one non-profit >>> organization here that I have worked with in the past. I don't mind asking. >>> 3- Establish the concept of committees that will address certain issues >>> like Publication, Education etc. >>> 4- Begin to (e-)publish our own material and cleanup/streamline/centralize >>> all common and educational material. Obviously, the proceeds should be >>> funneled back to the wocommunity and the non-profit org. >>> 5- Lastly, to establish an internship training/employment programs as well >>> as stipends intended to encourage new developers to join and to expose the >>> WO technology to a broader and younger audience. >>> >>> Many specialty medical organizations have similar structures as outlined >>> above. >>> >>> XeoTech, LLC >>> Patrick Abuzeni, MD >>> 248 Palermo Avenue >>> Coral Gables, FL 33134 >>> >>> Tel: 305-444-2888 >>> Fax: 305-444-2333 >>> >>> www.xeotech.com >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> On Mar 10, 2012, at 7:02 PM, David Avendasora wrote: >>> >>>> Hi all, >>>> >>>> I think it would be an excellent idea for WOCommunity to have an Apple >>>> Developer Account because it would give a unified face to the organization >>>> for Apps like RuleModeler, but it would also make it possible to release >>>> eBooks for things like "Getting Started with WebObjects" and such and >>>> create a way for the community to generate revenue. >>>> >>>> Sure, we can still offer the tools and content for free, but I'm betting >>>> that there are some people who will pay for them just because they *can* >>>> pay for them. >>>> >>>> Unfortunately, before we can create the account, I think that we really >>>> need to be a formal organization, which we have discussed several times. >>>> We can't leave everything to Pascal. He's only one person, and he already >>>> does an insane amount of work for the community. Maybe he's still the >>>> right one to do this, but then someone needs to take on some of the other >>>> work that he's already doing. >>>> >>>> Who will step forward and commit to taking on responsibilities? >>>> >>>> I'd be willing to take on Jenkins management and configuration. >>>> >>>> Dave >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>>> Webobjects-dev mailing list ([email protected]) >>>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>>> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/patrick%40xeotech.com >>>> >>>> This email sent to [email protected] >>>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >>> Webobjects-dev mailing list ([email protected]) >>> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >>> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/probert%40macti.ca >>> >>> This email sent to [email protected] >> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >> Webobjects-dev mailing list ([email protected]) >> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/snaduko%40gmail.com >> >> This email sent to [email protected] >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. >> Webobjects-dev mailing list ([email protected]) >> Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: >> https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/probert%40macti.ca >> >> This email sent to [email protected] > > > _______________________________________________ > Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. > Webobjects-dev mailing list ([email protected]) > Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: > https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/sparky005s%40yahoo.com > > This email sent to [email protected] _______________________________________________ Do not post admin requests to the list. They will be ignored. Webobjects-dev mailing list ([email protected]) Help/Unsubscribe/Update your Subscription: https://lists.apple.com/mailman/options/webobjects-dev/archive%40mail-archive.com This email sent to [email protected]
