OK, that's a nice thorough analysis, but you obviously haven't played tSG. In scenario 5 the player of tSG has a significant choice. He can side with the elves against the outlaws, or he can help the outlaws against the undead, and loose the support of the elves. Chaotic units are only accessible: in a particular branch of the story, after a significant choice which explains why a civilized commander would accept the same units into his ranks which he has been fighting the whole game.
As i've tried to point out before, Outlaws and the Loyalists are natural enemies. A campaign may give the player access to both but often with specific story-line justification. To make all L0s advance-able to Outlaws and Loyalists, really limits their usefulness to those rare campaigns that give you both opposed sides to the human world right from the start. My goals for these honestly are: 1) to make some L0 humans which would be generally useful 2) make some more appropriate L0 humans for tSG. I believe these goals are pretty compatible. But regardless of what happens in mainline (unless aelius objects) i'm making: "Ruffian" a chaotic club wielder which upgrades only to outlaws. "Townsman" a lawful guy which upgrades only to loyalists. We've already committed: "Woodsman" which upgrades to poacher and bowman a unit ideal for NR. I don't see the need to remake all L0s (even those NR won't use) into the lawful/chaotic mold that NR uses. -j.w. bjerk / eleazar On Apr 13, 2007, at 5:56 AM, Eric S. Raymond wrote: There's been some suggestion (notably from Eleazar) that a neutral or chaotic L0 with chaotic advances would make too many units available to Deoran. But, in fact, Deoran later gets the ability to recruit all the plausible advances for a chaotic Peasant. So, in this campaign at least, we can't screw it up much by having those in its advancement path.
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