Hey Luca, thank you so much for taking the time to read the proposal in detail, and managing to get through it.
Yes, I agree, you are right. This proposal, just as Wikidata, is good at exposing and identifying biases, but not that good at actually fixing them. I also think that this is OK - the fixing should probably not be something a tool should do, but that is up to us as the communities to get it done. In fact, as you can find in the Wikipedia@20 essay https://wikipedia20.pubpub.org/pub/vyf7ksah one of the considerations for Abstract Wikipedia is indeed to make it more explicit to see which biases are intentional in a language editions, and which ones are not, in the hope that we can then tackle certain biases in some language editions in a more targeted way. Thank you for your kind words, and I am also very excited to get this thing moving! :) Stay safe, Denny On Fri, Apr 17, 2020 at 7:56 AM Luca Martinelli <[email protected]> wrote: > Hey Denny, > > I've finally managed to reach the conclusion of your paper. It's truly > a lot to digest, especially for people like me who do not know much of > these things, but it was a really thorough and interesting read. > > One thing that got me thinking is the part about biases - please note > that it is not a critique, merely a *very* confused, and possibly > fairly terrible, thought about it :) > > So, biases exist, they inform most of the discussion about delicate > matters, and we're all "POV healthy carriers". In a way, this is fine > to a certain limit. Many people, though, "refuse" (for a lack of > better words) to acknowledge that in relation to themselves, and this > is a huge problem to overcome when we need to find a way to establish > a consensus about an as-much-as-NPOV-possible text about $subject. > > My fear is that all our attempts, from Wikidata to your proposal, are > extremely good at noticing where bias is or might be, where we should > point our attention to, but still aren't enough to fight back the > refusal to acknowledge a bias. We still need a way to find people > willing to tackle this, or at least giving them enough motivation to > solve this in our current working framework. > > On the bright side, I can see so many applications of your project > that I can't wait for it to happen. :) > > L. > > > > > > Il giorno mar 14 apr 2020 alle ore 03:10 Denny Vrandečić > <[email protected]> ha scritto: > > > > I sent a long email to Wikimedia-l and also made the same post to Meta. > I published a new paper recently with a proposal for a multilingual > Wikipedia and more, and, unsurprisingly, Wikidata plays a central role in > that proposal. I am trying to have the discussion not to be too fragmented, > so I hope it will happen on Meta or on Wikimedia-l, but I also wanted to > give a ping here. > > > > Stay safe! > > Denny > > > > [1] > https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2020-April/094621.html > > [2] > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Forum#Proposal_towards_a_multilingual_Wikipedia_and_a_new_Wikipedia_project > > [3] https://arxiv.org/abs/2004.04733 > > > > _______________________________________________ > > Wikidata mailing list > > [email protected] > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata > > > > -- > Luca "Sannita" Martinelli > http://it.wikipedia.org/wiki/Utente:Sannita > > _______________________________________________ > Wikidata mailing list > [email protected] > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikidata >
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