Wayne: So what comes first -- fancy expensive technology and no project?. Or a meaningful project which demands better technology and community support later down the track?
Yes, I agree. And RSS is fundamental technology to have these days, hardly fancy, free, and hopefully simple - or should be. I should have pointed out the problem with the RSS feature sooner. It has been broke for some time. Back when I built that FaceBook application is when I saw that it was broken. RSS affords so much to the project, like the development of FB and many other apps, as well as enabling subscription to things like the news page - which then compliments more discussion about Wikied in the EduBlogosphere - such as the celebrated notice from Stephen Downes recently, who is one of a great many that rely on RSS technologies, and also argues that such technology is fundamental to any education project. I appreciate the makeup of Wikied, and the extensive volunteerism that helps it run. Thanks for the responses now, and I hope we can have a functional RSS extension soon. Keep up the good work, we can always do better. Regards Leigh On Jan 12, 2008 10:10 AM, mackiwg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Leigh -- > > At the time you needed the support to fix the RSS extension -- we did > not have the capacity available to get the changes and installation > done on the server. > > We need to make tough calls and decisions on how we support a free > hosted service and bear the brunt of the folk who complain <smile>. > Like any organization we measure risks of downtime, demand for the > service, the kind of service we are trying to deliver bandwidth etc. > We try to do the best we can within our existing constraints. > Sometimes we get this right and other times we end up frustrating > users who have an urgent need - for example fixing the RSS feed. > > WE has been running pretty smoothly until now without any major > hiccups -- with increased usage and demands, things get more > complicated and cost more money. So now the time is right to move to > the next Phase of our hosting of the project. That said - COL's budget > is also finite -- and we need to think a little down the track, for > example what if WE has 1 million users and needs a sizable server > farm. COL doesn't have the funding for this level of demand -- so we > need to work towards a community model where we all do what we can for > a bigger vision. Its upside down thinking - but that's the open source > way. > > I'm personally very happy with the outcome and in the long run I'm > confident that we will end up with a better project. It's a chicken > and egg problem -- we cannot warrant the expenditure of a $250 000 > hosting service when for example it is possible to do this for under > $5000 with very efficient software and very smart people who donate of > their time because they believe in what we're doing. We are a > community project and we rely heavily on volunteerism to achieve our > aims. That said -- if we didn't start WikiEducator on a shoe-string > budget -- we would never have achieved what we have to date. > > So what comes first -- fancy expensive technology and no project?. Or > a meaningful project which demands better technology and community > support later down the track? > > When I started WE, I opted for the latter because there was nobody > else to help me take the decision. The server was running before we > had any community <smile>. Thank goodness for free software! > > Cheers > Wayne > > > > > > > On Jan 11, 11:12 am, "Leigh Blackall" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > Thanks Wayne, and like I said, good decisions, but I am struggling to > > understand why the request to fix the RSS extension (simply update it to > see > > if it will fix it) has not been done. The video extension looks great! I > am > > excited by it, just as much as the PDF and ODF exports... but meanwhile > the > > RSS is broke and it is a fundamental technology. This is what is > frustrating > > me. My second guessing has less to do with the decisions and more to do > with > > the support. > > > > On Jan 12, 2008 4:45 AM, mackiwg <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > Leigh Blackall wrote: > > > > > > Many of the features Wayne and you have introduced are pretty good > > > though, but it > > > > is a concern that they are introduced without any evident > consultation > > > > with the "community" while the "community" requests seem to go by > > > > without even a trial! > > > > > For the record -- the technology road map where Liquid Threads was > > > introduced to the community was uploaded on WE on 19 February 2007 -- > > > (see > > >http://www.wikieducator.org/index.php?title=WikiEducator_roadmap&oldi. > .. > > > ). > > > > > It's great to have a technology that records every edit and is open > > > for anyone to contribute. > > > > > There were no objections noted on the relevant talk pages. > > > > > I ran an online workshop using Moodle and the Newbie Tutorials in > > > March 2007 with 78 participants around the world. Newbies were > > > confused by using an external Moodle forum for discussions while the > > > tutorials were on WE. I recieved numerous complaints from this group > > > of WikiEducators. We took the decision to resource and develop LQT. I > > > don't have the exact dates with me -- development commenced in May > > > 2007. > > > > > There was a window period of at least 3 months for WikiEducators to > > > communicate that they did not want discussion functionality improved. > > > Yes - I take full responsibility for the decision to go ahead with > > > the development of LQT on WE -- which we have released back to the MW > > > community. > > > > > Thinking about Kaltura ... > > > > > Leigh -- you have unashamedly been the most vocal advocate in the WE > > > community concerning the need to incorporate 3rd party rich media. I > > > share your enthusiasm for the pedagogical potential of rich media in > > > education. In the same breath I have been conservative in simply going > > > ahead with the incorporation of extensions due to concerns associated > > > with proprietary software and the risks of excluding the developing > > > world. Kaltura seemed like a good compromise -- while extensively > > > based on Flash technology -- the code is being released as open > > > source. I'm very uncomfortable with this reliance on Flash and > > > proprietary media formats because this will make it very difficult to > > > collaborate with other free content projects. > > > > > Leigh you are right -- there was not extensive discussion with the > > > community whether we should or shouldn't test the extension. I made a > > > value judgment that it would be in the interests of the community to > > > test the technology before taking decisions on whether to incorporate > > > this or not. However -- we did not in any way imply that this was a > > > community decision -- in Erik's notification he wrote "Per discussion > > > with Wayne I've turned on the Kaltura extension" and on the > > > instructions page there was a very clear statement that this was > > > merely a test. Again - I take full responsibility for this decision. > > > > > WE is a community project funded by an international development > > > agency. (Note -- we are not a technology company <smile>.) We believe > > > firmly in the merits of the WE project in widening access to education > > > by developing a free curriculum. However, we are taking one step at a > > > time. Relatively speaking we are still a very small community by > > > comparison to the WMF projects -- consequently the costs of hosting > > > more than one server have not been warranted. The downside is that we > > > do run a risk of downtime. > > > > > As the sole funder of WE -- COL has done it's best to ensure and > > > promote a participatory community governance model. Early in 2007 I > > > nominated an international advisory board for the project with a clear > > > statement that when we reach 2500 users we will democratically elect a > > > WE council for the project. You will be aware of these discussions. As > > > COL funds this project -- I have a fiduciary responsibility to act and > > > yes -- take decisions in what I believe to be in the best interests of > > > the initiative. I'm sure that I've made mistakes and don't get things > > > right all of the time. But hey -- there are elections coming up and > > > the community can vote whoever they want onto the Council to lead the > > > project. > > > > > A successful project is one which can sustain itself -- if after a few > > > years they project cannot run on its own -- it's been a failure. So > > > our hosting discussions are an excellent test for the robustness and > > > commitment of the community to our collective project. I'm > > > particularly pleased that the contributions to the list so far are > > > opting for a strong community driven model as opposed to a commercial > > > hosting solution -- that's a good sign for ongoing success. > > > > > Leigh wrote: > > > > > >>I too hope this community (or I) do not begin second guessing WE, as > a > > > hell of a lot has been invested in it this end. > > > > > I hope that you will not need to second guess WE -- OtagoPoly are > > > establishing a leadership position within NZ in the free knowledge > > > movement. That said, I do not want you to feel that your work is at > > > risk. Therefore, I will arrange for a database dump of all WE content > > > so that OtagoPoly can access a copy of all your work to date should > > > you wish to migrate to another hosting solution. > > > > > Paradoxically -- last night Google groups were having major issues. So > > > if a big corporate like Google can have access issues with their > > > servers -- I guess its OK for a small operation like COL to have a few > > > growing pains with its free content project <smile>. > > > > > Cheers > > > Wayne > > > > -- > > -- > > Leigh Blackall > > +64(0)21736539 > > skype - leigh_blackall > > SL - Leroy Goalposthttp://learnonline.wordpress.com > > > -- -- Leigh Blackall +64(0)21736539 skype - leigh_blackall SL - Leroy Goalpost http://learnonline.wordpress.com --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "WikiEducator" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/wikieducator?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
