As I just wrote on https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/CentralNotice/Request/Wiki_Loves_Monuments_2021
As I tried to say earlier on the Meta page, I am trying to make sure a banner works, but decision making around banners should be done with the international in dialogue with the local teams and the broader community. The discussion on the mailing list and here is very very limited in comparison to the number of people involved. This is concerning.Another concern is that the proposal above, to implement a diet with a "cooldown" is I think enlarging an existing problem (banner blindness) and creating a new problem (new participants who can't find back the instructions page, aka less uploads). Let me try to explain. Banner blindness is influenced by for major factors: 1. The first factor is how many different banners a person sees in a certain period. If someone sees 6 banners in a certain period, banner blindness is worse than only seeing one banner in that period. 2. The second factor is how many times a certain banner is visible above the pages. If a banner is only shown five times, it is less blinding than when seen 50 times. If a banner disappears, a lot of users will think this banner is gone (but when a cyclus is in place the annoyance can be larger, see 4). 3. The third factor is on how many different wikis someone is active on which the same banner is shown. If a diet is put in place (let's say 5x shown) and a user has visited above that number of pages, a banner disappears (or after clicking it away), that same banner will re-appear when that user visits another wiki. A diet does not work cross wiki. 4. The fourth factor is how many cycles a banner is shown to a single user. (A cycle means that when someone got a banner a few times, after some time (days/weeks) a banner can be shown again for a few times.) While this is actually the same banner, a lot of users would experience this as a second/third/etc banner, or in other words, the banner blindness is higher. (There can be also other factors in place, like banners that are shown but are relevant for only an extremely low number of viewers, as well as banner designs (like moving flags) that can create much annoyance, but above I just focussed on the different ways of how the same banner can be shown.) The third factor (in my opinion) should have been fixed already five years ago and is a long standing problem. However I do see some progress, you can now disable certain type of campaigns in your preferences if you do not want to see them: Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-centralnotice-banners <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:Preferences#mw-prefsection-centralnotice-banners> . *Concerning the proposal to put a diet in place with repeating cycles:* At first sight this proposal seems to be helpful to reduce banner blindness and annoyance for banners. However, users would not get the banner once, but four times (factor 4), which would cause 4x the annoyance, and if they work cross wiki this would double/triple/etc the amount of banners they experience (factor 3). But more importantly: this diet would cause a major issue: new editors can't find back the instructions page of the photo contest when they re-visit Wikipedia (or the page is otherwise much harder to find back). In other words: a lot less photos uploaded by a less diverse amount of uploaders. I am a huge fan of diets, but above all a banner (+diet) must by *suitable* for the goal of the banner. In other words, the WLM banner has 2 goals: 1. to inform people about the contest ongoing, 2. after participants have made photos they return to Wikipedia and then the banner has as goal to enable participants to find back the instructions page. The proposed diet is obstructing the second goal and is damaging for the photo contest. So if you as local organisers do not wish a bad effect because a diet is in place, replying on the Meta page and/or here on the mailing list would be needed. Romaine Op di 31 aug. 2021 om 03:56 schreef Romaine Wiki <[email protected]>: > In WLM 2019 and 2020 there was no diet set. > > Romaine > > Op do 12 aug. 2021 om 22:23 schreef Alexander Tsirlin <[email protected] > >: > >> Dear Lodewijk, >> >> In order to answer your question, it would be useful to have information >> on which diet was eventually implemented during WLM-2019 and 2020. Do >> you have any such data? >> >> An information on the banner diet during WLE-2021 would be even more >> useful because all countries with a large number of uploads showed a >> significant reduction this year compared to 2020. While COVID-19 could >> play some role here, I suspect that it was not the only culprit. >> >> Sincerely, >> Alexander >> >> >> >> On 8/12/2021 9:53 PM, effe iets anders wrote: >> > Hi all, >> > >> > I just wanted to collect some input on the WLM banners. >> > >> > As background: the centralnotice banners are the most important way >> that >> > we make newcomers aware of our competition, but it is also the main way >> > many other efforts get attention. This is a scarce resource, that we >> > should use responsibly. >> > >> > When we started Wiki Loves Monuments, the sitenotice was primarily >> > all-or-nothing, and the community was very much at ease with such an >> > important competition getting this attention. As time progressed, the >> > option to institute a "diet" was added. Unfortunately, the >> documentation >> > of this is pretty poor, but it looks like this basically constitutes of >> > a maximum number of times that a given device sees the banner within a >> > given span of time. Typically, this number is set at 5 (you only see a >> > banner 5 times), but there is an option to 'reset' that counter to show >> > the banner another 5 times, for example the next week. Some options I >> > would see as feasible (but more experienced sitenotice designers may >> > know more creative solutions) would include: >> > - Show this banner X times in total per device >> > - Show this banner X times per week per device >> > - Show this banner once per day >> > - Show this banner once per Y page views >> > etc >> > >> > The community has also flagged over the past years that showing the >> > banner without limitation becomes harder to justify as the number of >> > campaigns increases. >> > >> > Experience teaches us that the effect of a banner diminishes over the >> > number of times it is being shown to people. It may be a small cost to >> > us to determine a diet. For simplicity's sake, we should probably try >> to >> > come up with one-size-fits-all with some possible local exceptions if >> > special events happen (e.g. a national monument open day). >> > >> > Now the question is: what is a reasonable and optimal diet to request? >> > This is a tricky balance to strike: what is still enough to almost >> > achieve optimal impact, but minimize the 'cost' in our readers' >> > attention? If people have not clicked on a banner the first five times, >> > will they click on it the sixth? >> > >> > I invite all national organizers to share their insights here or on the >> > public discussion page. If we can come to a consensus of what we think >> > is a fair diet, then we're also more credible with our request for >> these >> > essential resources. I have my own thoughts, and I'm sure others on the >> > international team have them too. But first, I'd love to hear some more >> > thoughts. What diet would be fair and practical, if any? >> > >> > Lodewijk >> > (former international coordination team) >> > >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list >> > To unsubscribe send an email to >> [email protected] >> > http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org >> > >> >> -- >> This email has been checked for viruses by AVG. >> https://www.avg.com >> _______________________________________________ >> Wiki Loves Monuments mailing list >> To unsubscribe send an email to >> [email protected] >> http://www.wikilovesmonuments.org > >
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