Why did you mail this to the public mailing list? It seems to be a private communication.
,Wil On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:38 PM, Newyorkbrad <newyorkb...@gmail.com> wrote: > Wil: > > Please take this particular aspect of the discussion offline without > further postings about it. > > There are entirely legitimate reasons for my request and for the > expressions of concern from others that have come through in the past > couple of hours. This request is not an attempt to stifle any form of > Wikipedia/Wikimedia criticism nor your becoming more familiar with the > projects and their communities. > > Newyorkbrad/IBM > > > On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 10:23 PM, Wil Sinclair <w...@wllm.com> wrote: > >> What??? >> >> What talk page are you talking about? How in the world am I making an >> unsafe environment? >> >> Those are some *very* serious charges. I'm really just stunned. >> >> *No wonder people are afraid to post here!* >> >> ,Wil >> >> >> >> On Wed, May 28, 2014 at 7:08 PM, Risker <risker...@gmail.com> wrote: >> > On 28 May 2014 21:37, Molly White <gorillawarfarewikipe...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> > >> >> > Harassment: Has harassment been addressed in a comprehensive way on >> >> > all sites, including all of the WP site? As an example, Wikipedia has >> >> > had a problem with low and declining female participation for years, >> >> > and the WMF has often stated that it would like to address it. Are >> >> > women actively encouraged to participate on Wikipedia by the WMF or >> >> > other organizations? If we're not doing everything to protect women >> >> > and all other Wikipedians, is it morally or ethically correct to >> >> > perform outreach to potentially vulnerable groups? I'd especially like >> >> > to hear about this from a female perspective. >> >> >> >> A great start would be to hold this conversation in a safe space where >> >> people can discuss without fear of reprisal. I do not mean to say that >> >> wikimedia-l, nor any other public Wikimedia mailing list or page, is an >> >> inherently unsafe place to hold this discussion—that's not the case at >> all. >> >> But trying to hold this discussion after all the drama that you have >> been >> >> passing through this list in the past few days makes this a scary place >> for >> >> myself and others to post. >> >> >> >> You have ensured that this list has Wikipediocracy's rapt attention. >> >> Although I don't doubt the folks over there pay some attention to the >> >> regular goings-on of this list, the threads that you have been >> motivating >> >> and interacting with mean that every comment to this list is being >> >> scrutinized, and anyone they dislike is being torn apart. You have also >> >> shown that you have been interacting with and, at least to some degree, >> >> sympathizing with at least one person who, I feel, is dangerous. >> >> >> >> You have created a space where comments are being picked apart by a >> group >> >> of >> >> people eager to find or fabricate any flaw. My revision-deletion of an >> >> extremely violent and threatening edit was construed not as a standard >> >> admin >> >> action but as some sort of "clean-up" after someone whom they feel I am >> >> desperate to protect or cover up. You have drawn the attention of a >> >> dangerous user, who had not had contact with me for quite some time >> until >> >> now. You have the attention of at least one, likely more, of the people >> who >> >> created the racist, sexist, and threatening attack/doxxing pages >> mentioning >> >> me at EncyclopediaDramatica. >> >> >> >> So you'll have to excuse me when I'm somewhat unwilling to give my more >> >> in-depth "female perspective" here and now. >> >> >> >> Yours, >> >> Molly (GorillaWarfare) >> >> >> >> >> > >> > I'm going to second what Molly says here, Wil. I'm a woman who has held >> > positions that have attracted abuse and harassment (directed both at me >> > and my family) throughout the movement for years, and the first time I >> have >> > ever felt unsafe on this mailing list was today. >> > >> > You knew that the subject you were raising here had already caused a >> > Wikimedia staffer to take the (very unusual) step of advising his ED that >> > s/he felt unsafe because of your actions, not to mention the post that >> was >> > left on a talk page. Let me tell you, Wil, 85-90% of women would never >> > edit Wikipedia again if that post had been left on their talk page. And >> > yet, you could not leave it alone. It was all about you, and how you >> were >> > done wrong by, and how you didn't like how someone who has a long history >> > of making violently and sexually graphic abusive posts on English >> Wikipedia >> > (and other places) was treated. (I'm pretty sure he didn't get around to >> > telling you why he was banned, but you knew by the time you were drawn >> away >> > from IRC.) >> > >> > So..you perpetuated the feeling of unsafeness for your own purposes >> rather >> > than respect that your actions (whether intentionally or not) had created >> > that unsafe setting. Several community members tried to draw you away >> from >> > continuing in this vein, myself included, but you were not to be >> deterred. >> > Your determination to continue to perpetuate this unsafeness, by actively >> > participating in the ridiculing of Wikimedians, is precisely the kind of >> > behaviour that makes Wikimedia projects so unpleasant for women. >> > >> > I've been trying very hard to keep an open mind about you, despite your >> > unwillingness to modify your behaviour or even try to work with the >> > Wikimedia community. But today, you went too far. >> > >> > Risker >> > _______________________________________________ >> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >> > Wikimediaemail@example.com >> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines >> Wikimediafirstname.lastname@example.org >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, >> <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> >> > _______________________________________________ > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines > Wikimediaemail@example.com > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, > <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe> _______________________________________________ Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines Wikimediafirstname.lastname@example.org Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>