Gerard, as a queer black trans person who feels unsafe even in San Francisco (and has felt that way for years), I would really appreciate you not pushing last night's election results in my face to make a point.

- Pax


On 11/9/16 8:24 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:
Hoi,
Do you blame me for not feeling safe going to the USA?
Thanks,
      GerardM

On 8 November 2016 at 11:08, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com>
wrote:

Hoi,
Not going to North Corolina is absolutely fine with me. We do not gain
anything by going there arguably not to any state in the United States.
What Wikimania is, is a platform for propaganda for what we have, what we
do, who we are and how we do what we do. In many countries Wikipedia is not
the house hold name it is in the USA.

Wikimania is not aimed for the English Wikipedia, it is aimed to further
our movement. Not going to places is similar to saying that those other
people, speaking other languages, with an other culture do not matter. They
do.

We should go to Russia, India, South Africa, China. The people of those
countries should matter to us, the people we could share the sum of all
knowledge with.

THAT is what we do, sharing the sum of all knowledge.

When the choice of the venue is only about being safe, we should not go to
the USA (I do not feel safe there), we should go to Germany, to Switzerland
and move the office as well. It is not likely to happen, not what I want
either.

If there is one thing about LBGT, it is that that struggle is still being
fought. Hiding and keeping away does not work. It does not help the LBGT
community. More importantly in this context it does not help the Wikimedia
community. For the latter it is vital to make our message heard.We aim to
share the sum of all knowledge and many people have not even heard of us.
Thank,
       GerardM

On 18 October 2016 at 16:00, Pax Ahimsa Gethen <
list-wikime...@funcrunch.org> wrote:

Gerard, this isn't about "holiday destinations", it's about human rights
and dignity. That's why I emphasized in my original post that I'm concerned
not only about the safety of conference attendees, but also about those
living in the host country. The choice of a venue in a location with a poor
human rights record reflects poorly upon Wikipedia/Wikimedia and our
mission to share knowledge. There's a reason a number of major companies
pulled their events and funding out of North Carolina after the restrictive
restroom laws were passed for example...

- Pax



On 10/18/16 6:26 AM, Gerard Meijssen wrote:

Hoi,
For me safety is to a large extend secondary to what we aim to achieve.
Our
primary goal is to improve on our primary goal and it is "sharing in the
sum of all knowledge". It is not for going to the perfect holiday
destination.
Thanks,
       GerardM

On 18 October 2016 at 13:56, Fæ <fae...@gmail.com> wrote:

Gerard, could you provide some tangible examples of how other safety
aspects of Wikimania would be compromised if there is any specific
attention paid to the safety of LGBT+ Wikimedians? I cannot imagine
how such a thing could be true.

Based on my reading, nobody in this thread has asked for the safety of
LGBT+ attendees to be "prioritized" over other safety aspects. Please
don't make it appear as if they have.

Thanks,
Fae

On 18 October 2016 at 11:42, Gerard Meijssen <gerard.meijs...@gmail.com
wrote:

Hoi,
I do care that everybody can come to places where they are safe. All
the
specific LGBT attention to safety is however on many levels problematic
when we prioritise this over other safety aspects. The big picture for
me
is that we need to go to places where bringing Wikipedia and what it

stands

for the most good. It is why I would go to Russia, to China to India to
South Africa.

--
fae...@gmail.com https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Fae


--
Pax Ahimsa Gethen | http://funcrunch.org


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