Anna,

I've now read what you quoted for a third time, and can confirm I did understand, and agree with, what you said. I'm sorry my summary was inadequate, and may have made it seem otherwise.


As for planning, I am not making assumptions, but perhaps interpreting differently from you. I'm happy to defer to Pine on the details; their recent message captures the gist of what I intended.

I can't give a solid estimate of the "half-life," but I do not think the enthusiasm I've seen (and the metrics I cited in my initial message on this thread) constitute a passing crush. I do think a "pause" that necessitates addressing uncertainty when discussing popular features can have a significant impact, and therefore should be minimized to whatever degree is attainable. I could be wrong, but that's my belief.

As for the request for more time, I guess I'm just not sure what to make of it. I make no demands, and I'm not sure I've heard Pine, James, DJ, or anybody in this thread make demands. Is there somebody with standing to grant such a request? I've heard it, and it makes sense. It's worthwhile to know that the team needs more time, and plans to share more on a scale that sounds like days-to-weeks. But if there's something specific being asked of me (or others on this list), I'm not clear on what it is.

I'd be happy to chat if you come back to it at the end of Q3, if you'd like.

-Pete

[[User:Peteforsyth]]


On 01/25/2017 06:38 PM, Anna Stillwell wrote:
On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 4:53 PM, Pete Forsyth <petefors...@gmail.com> wrote:

Anna,

Pete,

Your points are valid and well taken. If I may summarize what I think I
heard, it's basically: "Getting things right can be hard, and if full
preparations weren't made ahead of time, thorough answers may not be
readily available. Be compassionate/patient." Is that about right?

I appreciate that you are trying to understand what I mean. Thanks.

No, I didn’t say getting things right can be hard. I said, “This
communication thing is hard, especially when people are involved. Sometimes
there are laws that constrain what we say. Sometimes we don’t know whether
we are right yet and we need a further unpacking of the facts. The truth is
that there can be a whole host of reasons for partial communication that
aren’t related to competence or the intent to deceive.”

As for the preparations, it seems that a lot of assumptions are being made.
As for thorough answers, some might already be known and others known once
more planning is completed. However, it could be that the explanations you
want are not legal to share. There are many issues where employment law and
worker protections are crystal clear, as they should be.

As for compassion, I don’t require it. That seems like extra to me. I
usually prefer just paying attention, but that’s my personal choice.

The team asked for some time. I wondered if that would be a reasonable
request to grant them.

If so, I agree in principle and in spirit, but I think the point is in
tension with
another one:

Community and public enthusiasm for software can be a rare and important
thing. The conditions that make it grow, shrink, or sustain are complex,
and largely beyond the influence of a handful of mailing list participants.
The recent outputs of the Interactive Team have generated enthusiasm in a
number of venues, and many on this list (both volunteers and staff) would
like to see it grow or sustain, and perhaps throw a little weight behind an
effort to make it grow or sustain.

Good points. I mean that. Glad to hear of these recent outputs generate
excitement. I’m personally also getting quite excited about ORES
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Objective_Revision_Evaluation_Service> and
what’s going on with the Community Tech Wish List, Labs, and New Readers.
But I also get that you want to be clear: you'd like to see the interactive
team’s work grow or sustain. Makes sense.

The only thing I heard is that the team said that they needed to pause,
have a bit of time, and get back to everybody. “The team's aim during this
period is to get its work to a stable and maintainable state.”

But that enthusiasm has a half-life. What is possible today may not be
possible next week or next month. The zeitgeist may have evolved or moved
on by then.

I'm not in disagreement with your main point about enthusiasm for software.
I think it's a very good one. Enthusiasm with a half life of a week,
however, sounds more like a passing crush. Nevertheless, your point still
stands.

-Pete
--
[[User:Peteforsyth]]

/a
[[User:Annaproject]]

On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 3:53 PM, Anna Stillwell <astillw...@wikimedia.org>
wrote:

You make substantive points, Tim. Thank you.

"An employee should not experience their time off as a period where his
[her/they] work load is just temporarily buffered until his [her/they]
return, but where colleagues will step in and take care of business."

I take this point seriously and don't wish you to think otherwise. In
theory, I absolutely agree. In practice, sometimes we all face
constraints.
There are roughly 300 of us (order of magnitude). Every now and then,
there
are not enough of us to go around on everything on a timeline that meets
the legitimate need that you present here. We'll continue to work on
this.
But, to clarify, no one ever said it was a "useful practice" nor did
anyone
suggest that it was generalized across the org.

What I was wondering about in my previous email and now reiterating in
this
one too, are people willing to grant their request: a bit of time and
allow
for one person to return to work?

Does that seem like a way to move forward?

Warmly,
/a

On Wed, Jan 25, 2017 at 2:50 PM, Tim Landscheidt <t...@tim-landscheidt.de

wrote:

Anna Stillwell <astillw...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

[…]
I also hear that the pause on the interactive work is temporary. I’ve
heard
them request time. I am comfortable granting that request, but no one
is
required to agree with me. They’ve also said that the person with the
most
information is on vacation. As someone who has seen employees go
through
considerable stress in the last years, the entire executive team is
working
to establish some cultural standards around supporting vacations. We
want
people here to feel comfortable taking proper vacations and sometimes
that
can even need to happen in a crisis. People often plan their
vacations
well
in advance and may not know that something tricky will come up. Just
so
you
understand one bias I bring to this conversation.
[…]
I concur with DJ in his initial mail that this is not a use-
ful practice, and I doubt very much that it relieves employ-
ees' stress.  It conveys the organizational expectation that
employees are SPOFs without any backup.  An employee should
not experience their time off as a period where his work
load is just temporarily buffered until his return, but
where colleagues will step in and take care of business.
Especially such a major decision like "pausing" a team
should not depend on the inner thoughts of one employee, but
be backed and explainable by others.

Tim


_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>



--
"If you have knowledge, let others light their candles in it." - Margaret
Fuller

Anna Stillwell
Director of Culture
Wikimedia Foundation
415.806.1536
*www.wikimediafoundation.org <http://www.wikimediafoundation.org>*
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>





_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: 
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
New messages to: Wikimedia-l@lists.wikimedia.org
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, 
<mailto:wikimedia-l-requ...@lists.wikimedia.org?subject=unsubscribe>

Reply via email to