As hubs are not replacing the relationship between affiliates and affcom,
hubs purpose is to serve its community across multiple countries.  I can
see the value in Affcom sharing some of its experiences but I caution
against the building of deeper power structures that widen the gap between
individual contributors, the BOT, and the WMF.   That gap will get even
wider once the global council is put in place, there are already
significant communication problems, made worse by the lack of project
experience within the WMF staff, its contractors, and the BOT

For many years these hubs have successfully existed outside Affcom control,
I think there should be greater respect shown to hubs for that work
treating hubs as pilots is itself disrespectful. Outside of Europe where EU
law allows cross border responsibility, hubs governance structures face
considerable legal hurdles from insurance to individuals being required to
make themselves subject to the laws of another jurisdiction to hold a
position of responsibility.

<edit conflict with Ilario Valdelli>

> This discussion should be naturally a discussion done by the community and
> not by the Affcom itself, naturally, like it's happening for the whole
> strategy.

I wholeheartedly support this point, these discussions need to run
independent Affcom.

On Tue, 12 Jul 2022 at 16:34, Philip Kopetzky <philip.kopet...@gmail.com>
wrote:

> Hi Wojciech,
>
> thanks for this statement, it will definitely be helpful to have AffCom's
> insights into the current affiliates network when talking about hubs. While
> approval by the WMF BoT is one option, wouldn't that require a hub to be a
> formal organisation? Otherwise the BoT would be involved in micro-managing
> project grants that are funding some of the hub pilots.
>
> It would also be helpful to design the process in a way that has the
> Global Council in mind where in its absence the WMF BoT acts in its
> absence, to make clear that this is only a temporary solution because of
> how slow progress on the movement charter has been in the last two years.
>
> Best,
> Philip
>
> On Mon, 11 Jul 2022 at 20:54, Wojciech Pędzich <wpedz...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> During the strategic meeting of the Affiliations Committee (AffCom) in
>> Paris on June 24-26, members discussed how AffCom may be able to support
>> the movement in relation to the upcoming Hubs pilot process. We reviewed
>> two issues – whether it was within AffCom’s remit to contribute to the
>> Hub pilot process and if so, what our involvement might look like.
>>
>> AffCom has, since its inception in 2004, worked directly with all
>> Affiliates across the movement, i.e.: User Groups, Chapters, and
>> Thematic Organizations. Our role, as it has evolved, is to support these
>> different entities as they come into being and then as they grow, ensure
>> that they integrate best practices and with a view to long-term
>> sustainability. This has provided AffCom with both a broad overview, as
>> well as a deep understanding, of the various challenges faced by
>> affiliates across a range of circumstances that include socio-cultural
>> issues and affiliate-based conflicts. Hubs are intended to function as
>> formal movement bodies constituted by existing groups and/or affiliates,
>> able to  use Wikimedia trademarks to present their association. They
>> will need to be independent, legally constituted Affiliates, recognised
>> by the Board of Trustees. This introduces a significant and exciting new
>> Affiliate model to our movement and AffCom would welcome the opportunity
>> to bring our institutional knowledge and experience to assist in their
>> development.
>>
>> Recognising the principles of subsidiarity, the committee would like to
>> offer its support as an advisory body for the Hubs piloting process,
>> working with the community to develop a process that will lead,
>> ultimately, to their approval by the WMF Board of Trustees.
>>
>>
>> Wojciech Pędzich
>> on behalf of AffCom
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-- 
GN.
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