Hi Mayur,

Please elaborate on whether by one word article you mean articles with one
word in the title, or with one word in the whole article?

If the former, please justify the rationale. Why should a person who can
only read Hindi be barred from reading an article on a one-word object,
like  aeroplane, or car, or bicycle, or maths, or chemistry, or religion, or
universe, etc? (If it's the latter, leave it, my bad!)

And I can't help but wonder : if those 20,000 articles had only been marked
as spam / stub / bias / advertisement / vandalism / baby instead of
deleting, wouldn't at least some of them have evolved into good quality
articles by now?

I understand that the community (or a few people?) wants good quality at any
cost. But I don't see any plan of actually getting there; rather there seem
to be plenty of plans and bots in place to prevent it from happening at all.


I see the egoistic expectation of instant gratification rather than the
humble acceptance that there is a time-taking process for anything that is
to achieve good quality. I've seen what initially was written in the english
wikipedia article on India when it was first created. It was one line with
two typos. See image:
https://picasaweb.google.com/nikhil.js/Wikipedia10thAnniversaryMumbaiMeetup15Jan2011#5563528452106266818

Under the present "regime", it would have probably been deleted instantly
and perhaps the article would never have taken off and we wouldn't have any
article on India today. Or perhaps the person who started it, would have
been put down and might never have made the 118 edits he's done till now.

Is there any source from which we can get the list of deleted articles in
any wikipedia? I'd very much like to see it.
Would it be possible to see what their content was when they were deleted?
And also the users who deleted them?

If the above is not publicly (or, on request) available just like all the
other statistics are, then I fear we have a terrible hole in accountability
here. Like all other processes, wikipedia should have its deletion process
also transparent to all to prevent sabotage or hostile actions against the
community.

As a more effective solution, I would advocate that deletion be done only
when at least 3 or more admins concur, within a certain time interval, and
that too after a certain amount of time has been permitted for the article
to "prove itself". The talk page of the article is the perfect place for
such a dialog. This consensus-less deleting business seems a little too
creepy to be comfortable with in what is supposed to be a consensus-based
platform.


Cheers,
Nikhil Sheth
+91-966-583-1250
Pune, India
Teach For India <http://www.teachforindia.org/> Fellow, 2011-13
www.nikhilsheth.tk
Find me on: Twitter <http://twitter.com/nikhiljs> |
Facebook<http://www.facebook.com/nikjs>|
LinkedIn <http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs> | Google
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Do it Pune <http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659> |
Toastmasters in
Pune<http://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746>|
Wikipedia
For Schools 
project<http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition>

On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 12:01 PM, mayur <mayur...@gmail.com> wrote:

> if we would not have deleted 20, 000 articles in last 3 months we might
> cross 1 lakhs articles threshold, But we want to maintain Quality and
> Quantity Both.We have banned only one word article through abuse filter
> because 99.99% of them are vandalized articles.if  Any body go beyond one
> word he will be able to write an article in hindi wikipedia.
>
> Thank you and Regards
> Mayur
> Hindi Wikipedian
> On Mon, Mar 21, 2011 at 7:15 AM, Nikhil Sheth <nikhil...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Hi All,
>>
>> I'm not fully sure where the community is going on this topic, but here's
>> my two cents on deletion of articles in Indian /any language wikipedias:
>>
>> *It should not happen. Period.*
>>
>> At least not until we reach a qualitative number that is proportional to
>> the population of people in the world that knows that language. Look at the
>> charts. Where is any Indian language? Hindi is bloody 
>> 39th!<http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/List_of_Wikipedias>The Lithuanian 
>> language has more articles than we do! Do you think there are
>> more Lithuanian speaking people on this planet than there are Hindi speaking
>> people?? How about we ask them if they went on a murdering spree when they
>> were #39??
>>
>>
>> Q: But 95% are vandalism/biased/useless!
>> A: So put a "Vandalized article" template on it that says it in
>> HUMONGOUSLY HUGE letters that even a chimpanzee can read and put it out
>> there that we need someone to come and un-vandalize it, for the humanity's
>> sake! If we treat articles on wikipedia as living documents, then what we
>> are doing by deletion is genocide.
>>
>> Q: But they decrease the quality!
>> A: Why are you expecting a 5 minute old baby to score well in a 12th grade
>> exam? Do you mind giving it some time to mature on its own before failing it
>> and then fussing about "oh, it's not good enough!" Who gave anybody the
>> right to judge a baby's future potential?
>>
>> Q: But they are dangerous to the community and Humanity and blah and
>> blooh...!
>> A: First, take your ego and any pride you may have, and shove it. Then,
>> prove your claims. One stub/vandalized article that is publicly declared to
>> be a stub / vandalized article.... is going to end the world? Oh, really!!
>> Is it going to show India in a bad light? Who the bloody hell gave
>> wikipedians the authority to represent India? Who voted you into power??
>> Does the English Wikipedia represent UK/USA ? Can we please de-link the
>> nation from its languages? Last I checked, a lot of non-Indians speak Hindi
>> the same way a lot of Indians speak German or Japanese.
>>
>> Q: What's the problem with deleting crappy articles?
>> A: The exact same problem that comes from Indians aborting a girl child
>> because in their present environment they feel she will be a crappy addition
>> to the family. Right now, at this point in time and space, YOU may feel that
>> the particular article isn't necessary. Your opinions are subjective to the
>> environment you are in. Your opinion may change tomorrow, but that
>> contributor you chased out will not come back just like all those girls we
>> aborted will not come back, or like all those mothers who were forced to
>> abort, will not forgive their husband or in-laws. I beg YOU to live and let
>> live. Suspend your judgment; don't be so harsh in your pursuit for
>> perfection. It might turn out that the article you allowed to exist today
>> may become the BEST article in that wikipedia tomorrow, the same way that
>> girl child we do not abort today may become a role model for all Indians
>> tomorrow.
>>
>> *Suggestion: How about creating a "baby" template and so setting a proper
>> path to maturity, making room for the extremities of puberty (aka, bias,
>> vandalism etc etc) in between while preventing this genocidally judgmental
>> behavior?
>> *
>> Q: What's the problem with deleting?
>> A: Do you have a problem with NOT deleting? Are those few bytes occupied
>> going to bring the servers down? Do you mind putting a template there and
>> backing off? Do you mind thinking constructively for once?
>>
>> Q: If we encourage the vandals, they'll get more prolific and they'll...
>> A: ...And we'll revert the instances of vandalism, identify and block the
>> repeat offenders, or influence them to turn a page like we always do. Every
>> vandal is a human being that isn't programmed the way your are accusing
>> him/her to be. Nobody has any evil agenda against our wikipedias. There is
>> no incentive for anyone to do what we are  fear-mongering about; rather the
>> only incentive exists in the opposite direction. Stop living in a warped
>> psychological state where we need an enemy to justify our own existence,
>> stop destroying the future in the name of defense against an enemy that does
>> not exist. If you're sure they do, please prove your claims. The problem we
>> are discussing is about deletion of new articles. Don't hijack it with
>> insecurities, negativity and fear-mongering.
>>
>>
>> Even in English Wikipedia, there is a growing movement to stop speedy
>> deletions that are being perceived by many to have gone out of control and
>> to be doing more harm than good, for they are giving disproportionate power
>> to the incumbents. Over the next few years, expect a rot and stagnation
>> there if these destructive attitudes continue. Just because some one else is
>> possibly jumping off a cliff, why should we?
>>
>> *Some wikipedians look at articles the way they are and wonder "Why"? and
>> then go around deleting them like it's their God-given duty to throw the
>> baby out with the bath water.
>> I dream of articles that never were, wonder "Why Not?" and believe in
>> allowing those 95% new crazy articles to EXIST, because within a few years,
>> as surely as the sun rises from the East, I guarantee you almost all those
>> articles will transform into non-vandalized and good articles if you just
>> allowed them to breathe a little instead of murdering them.
>>
>> Controversial Statement: Today, it is the deleters among the community
>> that are the real Vandals of Indian language wikipedias, for they are
>> unintentionally destroying the future while pretending to defend a feeble
>> present.
>> *
>> (hey, we say the new editors shouldn't take it negatively or personally
>> when they are charged with vandalism or bias and their creations are wiped
>> out... now let's see our oldies stand up to the same test! Feeling offended
>> on being called Vandals, guys? Don't take it personally! :P)
>>
>> Yeah, that's about it. Peace, May you all Live and Let Live and not commit
>> bloody genocide in the name of quality.
>>
>> PS: The baby analogy will DEFINITELY bring more female editors in. Try it!
>>
>> Cheers,
>> Nikhil Sheth
>> +91-966-583-1250
>> Pune, India
>> Teach For India <http://www.teachforindia.org/> Fellow, 2011-13
>> www.nikhilsheth.tk
>> Find me on: Twitter <http://twitter.com/nikhiljs> | 
>> Facebook<http://www.facebook.com/nikjs>|
>> LinkedIn <http://in.linkedin.com/in/nikhiljs> | Google
>> <http://www.google.com/profiles/nikhil.js>| 
>> RangDe<http://www.rangde.org/investor/nikhilsheth>
>> Join me on: Pune Documentary 
>> Club<http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=138497769525636>| Let's
>> Do it Pune<http://www.facebook.com/pages/Lets-do-it-Pune/103857326346659>| 
>> Toastmasters
>> in Pune<http://www.facebook.com/pages/Toastmasters-in-Pune/148767611833746>| 
>> Wikipedia
>> For Schools 
>> project<http://education.wikia.com/wiki/Wikipedia_For_Schools_Offline_Edition>
>>
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