On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 12:42 PM, Hisham <his...@wikimedia.org> wrote:

> Nothing is conducted solely by India Program - and hence I said
> "supported."  Everything is conducted by the community - sometimes under
> the aegis of the Chapter and sometimes independently.  The support that we
> have provided varies - from getting the actual event fixed up to providing
> presentation material to interested community members to participating in
> these events.

Can this be clearly specified in the report?  That is more helpful than
simply "supported".  For instance, when you say "Supported the community to
get a venue in Guwahati University", it would help us understand more if
you could tell us how.

 On Wed, Mar 7, 2012 at 12:45 PM, CherianTinu Abraham <tinucher...@gmail.com
> wrote:

> Hi Pranav,
> In India, it is extremely difficult to hairline separate who has done
> which event. - Chapter, Community and WMF India Programs.

I agree it's not possible to do that, but it is entirely possible to list
out the work done in specific.  This enhances our accountability and
transparency towards the community.

> Let us take the case of the Trichy event, the request came to a community
> member Rsrikanth to the chapter. Nitika was actively involved along with me
> and Naveen. The chapter signed the MoU and supplied some goodies. Nitika
> was actively involved in coaching Sohan, a chapter member and Rsrikanth.
> One must not also forget that both Hisham & Nitika are also chapter
> members.

Fact: Nitika is a paid employee of the WMF India Programs and is not a
chapter/community volunteer.

> Another event in Chennai (Jaya eng college) , where Subha led, his travel
> expenses was reimbursed by the Chapter, Subha is a Chapter SIG Chair .. The
> event is supported by Hisham & Nitika too. Subha is also an India Programs
> executive.

Fact:  Subhashish, former volunteer, and now paid consultant with India

> I actively organize Bangalore Meetups and support several others .. Should
> I be worrying whether I am doing as a chapter member, board member or a
> community member?

By a matter of principle, chapter and community volunteers are just...
volunteers.  Paid consultants are hired to executive specific programs, and
hence the results of their work and reports should be presented with
clarity.  Simply "supporting" something does not clarify the extent of
their involvement.

> As with Assam meetup recently, coordinated by Shiju, some of the expenses
> were met from a personal grant from the Foundation to me & Shiju.
> There was a recent Malayalam Wiki Academy in Bangalore organised by
> Malayalam Community. Some of them are also Chapter members. People like me
> and Naveen actively helped the event ..Are we doing as chapter board member
> or community member? We don't really know.. But we are just genuinely
> helping the movement, with worrying about what capacity we are doing it.

I don't think it's a good idea to separate the chapter and the community.
 The chapter is a membership-based organization and by definition an
umbrella organization which represents the community.  There is no reason
for differentiation as long as it is volunteer work done by a chapter

> The various academies that we do, some of the requests comes directly to
> the chapter, community or India programs, but each supporting each other in
> different capacities.
> Now Noopur is a GLAM Champion, Chapter member and Delhi SIG Chair and also
> part of Chapter Communications Team. She now also heads the Communication &
> PR for the India Programs.
> As I explained, it is difficult to separate the contributions of different
> entities or individuals for the Wikimedia  movement in India.
> IMHO, we should be only concerned about the outcomes of the event and not
> who gets the credit.

Even though the possibility of interfacing each other is high for different
entities and groups of volunteers working in India, there is a need for
differentiation and it is a question which cannot be avoided.  The
volunteers who work on their pet-projects while not being associated with
any of the entities are not expected to be as accountable as (i) the
chapter which receives or may receive grants from the Wikimedia Foundation
and donations from individuals and organizations in the country AND (ii)
the WMF India Programs which is run by multiple paid consultants.

So I don't see why we shouldn't care about differentiation, or why it may
be an undesirable thing to want to differentiate.  Ultimately we all want
results, yes, but we also need to understand causality because there are
significant amount of funds involved.  We need to differentiate because
there are different degrees of accountability involved both with the
chapter, the WMF India Programs and the volunteer who works with a grant.

Hope this helps.

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