Re: [Winona] FW: waste planning

[mkirsch]

[Winona Online Democracy]

My sincere thanks to Keith Nelson and to Eric S. for directing him to respond.  I know that Keith responded to the best of his ability, and to the limits his position would allow, but some of his important points were buried deep in hyperbole.   According to at least one former and one present city council member, the city waste water treatment plant has had a significant failure, to the tune of about a half million gallons of raw sewage ending up in the river.  And it wouldn't be the first time a government agency like the MPCA or EPA failed to provide oversight or a penalty, or even recognition that a problem occurred, or even had knowledge of a problem in the city of Winona.  This doesn't mean they don't occur.  Case in point close to home;  The current MPCA project at the old county landfill had almost no storm water plan enforcement at the start of the project.  It wasn't until a local citizen complained directly to Sheryl Corrigan (head of the MPCA) herself that enforcement of the MPCA's own rules took place.   Another case in point close to home;  State statues have required for years that cities have a Shoreland Ordinance in place and yet Winona has never had one and the DNR has not forced them to enact one.   I recognize that septic systems fail, city waste water treatment plants fail (Milwaukee and the Twin Cities have had some humdingers), and feedlot ponds and pits fail.   What I can't understand is Keith's public city position that septic systems are bad and yet the city has the capacity to hook septic systems within the city limits to their sewage treatment plant and yet they don't.  In fact, every year the city asks the county for permits for new septic systems within the city limits, and not just at the Prairie Island campground.  Almost nine years later, most of the former Winona Township is not hooked up to the city sewer plant.    What is the real city position on septic systems?  How can you have it both ways?   Enforcement and inspections?  About two years ago a local developer who lives within the city limits stood up at a very public city council meeting and complained about how awful his septic system was and all the problems he was having with it.  Has the city ever inspected it, required a fix, hooked him up to the city sewer plant?  No!   As one city waste water treatment plant worker told me personally, "the solution to our pollution is dilution" as the pumps continued pumping "treated" water into the river.    Properly designed, installed, and maintained septic systems are a better solution than dilution or floating our sewage down the river, MPCA/EPA rules or not.  The Winona County Soil and Water Conservation District has low interest loans available to land owners seeking to repair/upgrade their septic systems.                                                                                                                                                                   Mike Kirschmann   ----- Original Message ----- From: Keith Nelson To: Daren Engler ; winona@mnforum.org Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2006 11:05 AM Subject: RE: [Winona] FW: waste planning [Winona Online Democracy] Daren,             I agree completely with your statement that proper maintenance is the key to keeping the individual septics working correctly.  The report in the attached link states 39% are failing or an immediate threat. I’ve read an EPA or MPCA report that shows a higher number.  I’ll look for that later. http://www.pca.state.mn.us/publications/reports/lrwq-wwists-1sy04.pdf Apparently at least 39% of people are not doing proper maintenance.  This issue, as many, is politically difficult to address.  The City of Winona requires that sewer systems with in the city be inspected every three years.  If not working correctly, the system must either be brought into MPCA compliance or hook up to the municipal system.  The septic system at Prairie Island was installed for the shower/restroom building at the campground.  It is maintained correctly to keep it functioning properly.  In the six years I’ve been in town, and to the best of my recollection, the only wastewater bypass we have had was in the high floodwaters of 2001.  At that time, with the permission of the MPCA, we asked Froedert Malting to dump their process water, which is only high in starch, directly into the river.  That took some of the pressure off the overloaded sewer pipes and lift stations.  This waste water does not pose any health hazard and was incredibly diluted with the enormous volume of flows in the river at that time.  All government agencies were in agreement with this action. Take the time to read the MPCA report.  It’s kind of long, but it is a significant problem.  I’d encourage Dwayne  Voegeli to read it as well.   Keith Nelson City of Winona Public Works Department 507 457 8274     From: Daren Engler [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2006 10:15 AM To: Keith Nelson; winona@mnforum.org Subject: Re: [Winona] FW: waste planning       Keith and all,     50% to 80% sounds alarming.  Keith, do you have any documents or reports you could direct me to that state these numbers, and the details surrounding them?  I guess I could more easily imagine this number in a small group of septics, maybe due to improper installation by one contractor in a cluster development or something of the like.  I'm under the understanding that septic systems fail largely due to improper maintenance, not due to poor design or functionality.  Improper maintenance makes just about anything fail prematurely.     I know each type of system has their pros and cons, so can you elaborate on any failure by municipal systems.  I believe the city of Winona had a failure a few years back where the raw sewage was pumped directly into the Mississippi at a very large volume per minute.....I don't know the details, that's why I ask.  I would agree that this was probably the only reasonable alternative to flooding the streets, homes, and basements of residents with the raw sewage.     Can you also tell me anything you know as to why the city put in a septic system at the Prairie Island campground.....and what happens to this system at times of high water?  In all sincerity, wouldn't a holding tank be a better choice.  A holding tank that could be pumped empty just before high water comes.  I would assume when the water is high for a few weeks, anything in this septic system is flushed into the river.  Again, there's probably things I'm not aware of with the situation.     Thanks for any info, Keith.         Daren Engler   ----- Original Message ----- From: Keith Nelson To: winona@mnforum.org Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2006 8:56 AM Subject: [Winona] FW: waste planning   [Winona Online Democracy]     From: Keith Nelson Sent: Wednesday, May 03, 2006 8:34 AM To: winona@mnforum.org Subject: waste planning   The treatment of waste water is highly regulated by both the MPCA and the EPA.  First the treatment process does in fact kill dangerous bacteria both in the liguid effluent and the more solid biosolids.  The biosolids that Mr Kirschmann is talking about is separated organic material that is highly sought after for use as a supplement to farm fields.  Its use significantly reduces the need for certain fertilizers.  Constant testing, as well as testing of the testing procedure, is performed on all phases of the treatment.  The land application of the biosolids is monitored primarily for heavy metals.  Application and accumulation levels are carefully recorded and restricted.  All aspects of the applications sites are taken into account before being approved as an acceptable site by the MPCA and then it is only to willing land owners.   Waste water plant operators are certified through many levels of testing and years of experience, again through the MPCA. The Winona waste water plant has a spotless record with all government agencies.  Plant capacity is being used at only 60% and provides opportunity for continued community growth.   The current technology used at the Winona Wastewater treatment plant is as effective and environmentally friendly method to treat human and industrial waste as anywhere in the country and likely the world.  Legitimate concern should be raised in the use of individual septic treatment systems.  The rural tank and drain field approach is only a step above the individual privy (a big hole in the ground method).  MPCA records state that from 50% to 80% of the septic drain fields are failing and dumping human waste and household chemicals directly into surface and ground waters.  Of course animal feedlots are always a health concern.  Someone legitimately concerned with the environment would address these long before the highly regulated and effective municipal wastewater systems.       Keith Nelson City of Winona Public Works Department 507 457 8274   _______________________________________________ This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona Any problems or suggestions can be directed to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the Contact page at  http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org _______________________________________________ This message was posted to Winona Online Democracy All messages must be signed by the senders actual name. No commercial solicitations are allowed on this list. To manage your subscription or view the message archives, please visit http://mapnp.mnforum.org/mailman/listinfo/winona Any problems or suggestions can be directed to mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] If you want help on how to contact elected officials, go to the Contact page at  http://www.winonaonlinedemocracy.org

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