Can you tell us the brand/model for their patient/equipment location tracking
system?
Thanks.
-jcw
[UA Logo]
John Watters The University of Alabama
Office of Information Technology
205-348-3992
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jeffrey D. Sessler
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 3:14 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Above Ceiling AP installations vs. Prediction -
Hospital Environment
Near my home, Kaiser just completed a new state-of-the-art hospital and for the
patients, it’s has a very luxury feel to it. They’ve deployed Cisco for
wireless (for public and private), and the AP’s are all below the ceiling,
along with what appear to be cellular repeaters. Having the AP’s exposed
doesn’t appear to diminish the look at all - after all, there are lots of other
distractions on the ceilings such as fire sensors, call lights, etc.
What was really interesting is that they didn’t use the system for location
tracking of patients/equipment. They had a separate system that used these
tiny/flat/thin/flush “night light” looking devices that were plugged into power
outlets everywhere, and they formed a huge mesh location network. Amazing.
Jeff
From: "Cosgrove, John"
Reply-To:
"[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>"
Date: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 at 9:09 AM
To:
"[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>"
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Above Ceiling AP installations vs. Prediction -
Hospital Environment
Thank you Chuck. This is how I see it as well. As the deployment gets more
dense with AP’s walls become less of a factor. My other big resistance to this
is serviceability. In a Hospital we have Infection Control issues. You can’t
just get a step ladder and start poking around trying to find where and/or what
happened to your “hidden” AP. Also over time other installers come thru the
ceiling and do work so you never know what they may have done to your AP to get
it out of their way. Wi-Fi already has too many variables in involved and this
would add yet another layer.
Thanks.
JC
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Chuck Enfield
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 9:36 AM
To:
[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Above Ceiling AP installations vs. Prediction -
Hospital Environment
The question for me isn’t really whether to or not above the ceiling work or
not, it’s how predictable is it. Coverage from AP’s, be they above or below
the ceiling, is highly influenced by obstacle near the AP. For the most part,
there are more potential obstacle above the ceiling than below. If you survey
with the AP above the ceiling, and install the AP exactly where it was during
the survey it should work fine. If, on the other hand, the AP gets installed 1
foot away from where it was during the survey, you could get weak or no signal
somewhere you didn’t expect. AP’s installed below the ceiling are less likely
to have this problem. In most cases, as long as they’re installed within a few
feet of the surveyed location they’ll have the same coverage. Exception occur
if the AP get installed next to a large column, or bookcase, but these obstacle
tend to be much more obvious to the installed, than light fixtures, air
handlers, and ductwork.
That said, the more we design for density and the smaller our cells the less
important this becomes. If we assume the extreme case of one or more APs
located in every room (and also assume we’re not doing something as dumb as
setting the AP on top of florescent light fixtures or an HVAC duct), small
differences in position above the ceiling are unlikely to have any appreciable
effect on network performance.
FWIW, except for a tiny number of special cases we keep our APs (or at least
the antennas) below the ceiling. It provides more consistent results and
reduces the coordination required between the designer and installers.
Chuck Enfield
Manager, Wireless Systems & Engineering
Telecommunications & Networking Services
The Pennsylvania State University
110H, USB2, UP, PA 16802
ph: 814.863.8715
fx: 814.865.3988
From: The EDUCAUSE Wireless Issues Constituent Group Listserv
[mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ian McDonald
Sent: Wednesday, April 29, 2015 8:34 AM
To:
[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Above Ceiling AP installations vs. Prediction -
Hospital Environment
As long as you don't put the AP right over a ceiling frame joint, we seem to do
OK, again dependent on what else is up there.
Best regards
Sent from my phone, please excuse brevity and/or misspelling.
________________________________
From: Harry Rauch<mailto:[email protected]>
Sent: 29/04/2015 13:31
To:
[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
Subject: Re: [WIRELESS-LAN] Above Ceiling AP installations vs. Prediction -
Hospital Environment
We have done both above ceiling and below ceiling and found that it depends
what's above the ceiling. Ductwork, pipes, etc. affect about 10% of our
coverage. We have also tested the newer "in-the wall" devices that could be
applicable to your design. We chose Ruckus since a number of their devices,
including in-the-wall are immediately meshable if necessary without any work on
the controller's part.
Meshing has proven handy for us when we have had network feed issues at our
dorms. As long as the antenna gets power it will automatically link to an
active downlink antenna.
Harry Rauch Sr. Network Analyst Eckerd College 4200 - 54th Ave S St.
Petersburg, FL 33711
On 4/29/15 8:15 AM, Cosgrove, John wrote:
Looking to hear about anyone doing above ceiling AP installations and see how
the coverage compares to below the ceiling. I also don’t have much time or
resources to “play” around with the design since it will be in a hospital
environment.
I am pushing to keep the AP’s below the ceiling but the renovation area is
looking to have a “Luxury” feel. Facilities tells me to think “Luxury Hotel”.
Hotel wireless is not the same goal as Hospital wireless.
I suggested the paintable covers or the 2x2 drop ceiling enclosures. I think
they want a “No See AP” look.
Thank you for any comments on this issue.
John Cosgrove
Wireless Staff Specialist
Penn State Hershey Medical Center
Penn State College of Medicine
[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>
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Constituent Group discussion list can be found at
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