In our case, the most expense part of our VoIP deployment was getting our network ready to support it correctly. Whether the backend is outsourced doesn't affect the requirement to support end-to-end QoS. Therefore, I believe that you should either get in all the way or not at all.

The worst thing in the world you could do is bundle a 3rd party service that doesn't work very well and then because it is outsourced not be able to fix it.


Tom DeReggi wrote:


I agree with you on most of your comments.
However, there is more to it.

Offering VOIP is not just about making money on it. Its about controlling who has access to your subscribers, if one does not have the time to be a VOIP provider themselves. Bundling is a necessarily part of succeeding going in to the future. Its more important that ever to outsource VOIP, if it will likely never be a profitable business. let someone else loose the money, and reap the rewards of bundling today. Give the companies access to your clients that will be the lowest threat.

What benefit is it to allow, Vonage, ATT, Comcast, Verizon access to your client base, by allowing your subscribers to choose their VOIP options?

So Matt, I agree if the ISP/WISP intends to make significant money on the service, build your own. But don't knock the Primus/CommPartner models, they have their purpose and will enable many WISPs/ISPs to have an option to offer, that don;t have the resources to build their own.

What this industry needs to recognize is that there are industry trends that are going to gain market share, because consumers demand them and are willing to buy. They don't care who makes or looses money, they jsut know how to compare retail price they pay to the quality the receive. JUst like Muni broadband, its a reality of something that is going to happen. So my point is, pick the companies that you want to help succeed, and which ones you want to help NOT succeed, because some of them ARE going to succeed.

Tom DeReggi
RapidDSL & Wireless, Inc
IntAirNet- Fixed Wireless Broadband

----- Original Message ----- From: "Matt Liotta" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: "WISPA General List" <>
Sent: Monday, March 06, 2006 1:09 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP/PBX Gateway appliance

Primus/Lingo is calling every WISP in the country trying to sign them up for a very CommPartners like deal. All of these VoIP providers are using the same shitty model that will be worthless in 2 years time. There is no money to be made in VoIP short-term unless you operate your own equipment. Long-term, there is no money to be made in VoIP at all. VoIP will soon be a loss leader; plan for it or do get into the VoIP business.

BTW, Primus makes all their money on international termination. The domestic stuff is losing money hand over fist.


John Scrivner wrote:

Primus tells me they are more than a VOIP company and that they do make money. They impressed me in my dealings with them. Can you share more about your information about Primus? I have a big interest in knowing anything I can about them right now.

Peter R. wrote:

You haven't seen it yet, because Lingo is not profitable yet.
Primus owns Lingo and Primus is basically an International VOIP company.

Like so many VOIP Providers, they are still trying to figure out how to make a profit.

Delta3 (which is the backend for VZ's VoiceWing) made $9.1M in revenue in 4Q05 and just $22k in income.

Vonage has a customer acquisition cost that is 20 times their MRC.



Jonathan Schmidt wrote:

I've been personally delighted with two years of Lingo giving me
unlimited USA/Canada/EUROPE calling on 7 lines each for $19.95/month
and an unusually rich set of features (like e-mailing me compressed WAV
files of all incoming voicemails, etc.).
 Now, that's retail w/box and support.
I've taken the box on trips and routed it through my laptop Ethernet while the laptop is on a V.32 dialup and it works but sounds kind of like a cell phone but having my local number with me in Europe and having unlimited
free calls throughout Europe from Europe or Eastern Europe for ZERO
additional cost is kinda cool.
It's SIP but they keep promising a soft phone for the line, like Vonaga, but
haven't seen it yet.
 . . . j o n a t h a n

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